I think http://restlesssoma.com.au/restlesssoma/index.php?topic=3047.0 (http://restlesssoma.com.au/restlesssoma/index.php?topic=3047.0) Deceptions of Ego on a spiritual path fits with the foreign installation. There are spiritual paths which are designed for freedom, and then paths designed for the foreign installation.
This is really tricky because the foreign installation is so pervasive. All paths have some truths into them. But some paths are moreso like a cult than others. And you have to be careful in choosing them.
Later on the path Carlos started to become a cult. But before when he was hanging with Don Juan the path was real. But later he began to fall into the dark side on the path. He became famous and the fame appealed to him. He got caught up and the foreign installation sucked him in.
The foreign installation will offer power. But like impermanence works, it will be fleeting and will go away. The foreign installation promises permanency in attaining what you want. But it always goes away because we cannot keep anything.
And the madness of the FI knows our weaknesses very well. It is huge on a global scale, so how could it not know the little us? It is necessary to be vigilant and fight it at all costs.
I will not be a sheeple, you should say. I will not be a minion like the masses. Right?
I don't think this is the case.
For me, my experience, and perception , that foreign installation even if I don't use the term is not having to do with paths.
Most probably it's something personal but I think the foreign installation is up 'for' our conscience.
...
To put it a different way, my belief is that the path is something to travel, ...like a way,
while the foreign installation is something like a force with no ground, lets say.
With a legitimate path no. With a false path yes.
Notice the difference.
Intent can be called, of course, for anything, but sorcerers have found out, the hard way, that intent comes to them only for something that is abstract.
i will try to be careful here but maybe that don juan actually tricked carlos in many ways also when talking about the foreign installation in the second book separate reality he means a mosquito which is a flyer and the foreign mind is what the mosquito injects to us as some chemical which becomes our second mind. just some thoughts i have.
lol, endless you 've cut my post/thoughts into pieces. :)
/
Nik, I think you 're referring to a moth.
I think dj went to this as a gatekeeper of 'the' other world.
Not so sure.
And the Nat is the guardian to the other world, which you have to over come with your will, to enter.
Got ta love this.
(The Nat)
The mosquito.
Gnat :) But I know what he meant so it's all good.
You mean it's all good - with the foreign installation?
out of all the things I said, and you guys are talking about a Gnat. heh -.-!
You mean like BP?
You bet, and it's set up in your lounge room. Owned by the Chinese, designed by the Germans, paid for by your own little soul.
(PS... try being original)
When a multi-national sets up in your town, you buy the same goods that everyone else in the world buys.
When that extends to TV, you watch the same programs that everyone else in the world watches.
You wear the same clothes, eat the same foods, like the same things and dislike the same things, think and feel the same way - you believe yourself to be unique, but in fact you are simply copying.
You are pawn of a foreign entity - living, breathing and thinking what that entity feeds you. You flatter yourself on your uniqueness, but actually you are a puppet of another's will.
That is how the foreign instillation works. You believe your emotions are unique, while in fact if you only stepped outside yourself for a moment, you would see they are depressingly exactly the same as every human being ... who is asleep.
When you read a question on one forum and reproduce almost exactly word for word on another forum, you are doing the same - you are living a fashion. In this case a fashion of thought. Like wanting to wear Nike joggers, 'because those people are wearing them, I want to wear them also'. It's the cool idea going round.
The foreign instillation demands you toe the line and seek to replicate, thinking you are actually involved in some serious inquiry.
That is why I said "try being original".
Now if they start talking about pizza on another forum, and it becomes a 'hit' over there, and the original question is asked by someone who calls himself a 'nagual' - adding real gravitas - will you pop in here and ask exactly the same question?
I know it's hard to be original, but at least you could turn the idea around in your mind and come at it from a different angle.
Of course we would like to try on the latest fashion, but a little gesture against the most obvious infection of the foreign instillation's command is worthwhile ... like me calling it instillation instead of installation.
Definitely - it is real all right.
But the practice is to identify when we are experiencing a mood that is not inherent to our innate nature. An experience that is grafted onto us, and which we identify as ourself without question. Much the same way we adopt our parent's response characteristics, thinking they are our own.
The FI has raised it head again today around me. It does so every day.
I can say, that no matter what I say, no matter what people know intellectually about this 'thing', its hold on the minds and emotions of humanity is unshakable.
I know of no one, aside from myself, who has succeeded in escaping the grip of the FI. There may be people in here, or elsewhere that I know, who have escaped, but I don't for sure about it.
That will give you some idea of what we are up against. Its tentacles permeate every aspect of our lives. But worse than that, despite we may even know intellectually about this trap, in fact, we love the FI like nothing else. We love it more than anything else in our world or life. We cling to it and defend it to our death.
The FI is who we are - it is our identity.
I won't even speak of it's manifestation, because everyone will get upset and defend those traits as essentially human and personal. I give up. All I can do is enjoy the world as I pass through.
It won't work. No amount of probing will free you from what has been so long installed. It is too clever for that.
When it's shipping out the goods, there is no way you can stop it because you are completely consumed at that point.
Where you have to tackle it is where it has set up its constructs. But recognising those isn't going to help, because they are far too clever.
The only way to deal with it is to counter with repetitive and specific practice. Yes there are some that are very clever practices, but on the whole, it is the combined force of years of practice, until your emotional and mental being become too distasteful for any foreign investment.
What's the point of lining up endless spooks from every culture and time, and hoping they are all the same? Where does that get us?
What way...? Start by acknowledging that boredom is a withdrawal symptom - the best approach is always cold turkey.
So here lies a man
who sought to be free
His motto in life
was "I don't agree!"
I know of no one, aside from myself, who has succeeded in escaping the grip of the FI. There may be people in here, or elsewhere that I know, who have escaped, but I don't for sure about it.
There is a very revealing reason for this. It is almost impossible to know if a person has released themselves from the FI unless you actually live with them. You can't easily tell from a distance or a casual acquaintance.
To the trained eye you can see the embedded constructs in place, so you can make a good guess when it is obvious the FI is alive and well. But as with romance, people are able to put on a good show when connecting to others via the internet or for short periods.
It is amazing how all is revealed once you spend substantial time with another. That is the real test.
The best film I have seen on the FI is Lantana. If you watch this film, you will see exactly what the FI is all about.
i have not personally seen large heavy flying slugs, though I enjoy the image. i was already somewhat along the road by the time i read his flyer stories, and i had not till then formulated this view. but when i read his words, i knew immediately what he was talking about - i hadn’t seen that they too were spirits. and when the idea hit me i jumped for joy that someone else had seen this insidious thing - such a relief!
Believe in an ice-cream spirit if you will, I don't care, but I am here to speak of things final.
Doom and gloom? For who? If you mean my comments about humanity? Yes indeed - worse in fact. I can't begin to speak about the tragedy humanity has already sealed for itself, but that is not my task in this thread - sufficient to allude to it in principle.
To talk about the long journey of the universe is not relevant. The universe doesn't give a shit about this tiny speck in the cosmos - humanity's fate is like the fate of a gnat we kill without thought. In there is our own daily struggle - equally meaningless in the grand scheme. But bloody important to this little me I can assure you!
For us here in this forum ... alas, I speak about things because the topic suggests, and I like to speak. But I'm not fooled.
Facing us is a sheer wall. There is no foothold, no reference point, not top nor bottom. In fact there is no way whatsoever to scale this wall, but that is our task! Anyone who thinks they can flit over it on a whim is not worth bothering with. This task will drain every last ounce of blood from our soul, till it lies dead at our feet. Only those who have witnessed the death of their own souls, only those who have utterly lost all possible hope, and yet push forward for no reason whatsoever, except that it is the only way to live: only they find the answer to this wall. I say that because I have been through it, and I have lived to tell the story.
Believe in an ice-cream spirit if you will, I don't care, but I am here to speak of things final.
I know eventually humanity will be doomed, but I do not think it is in the near future. Everybody has a bomb and so far no one is using it. So I do have some hope for humanity. We may be clinging by a thread, but there are still a lot of good people in the world trying to keep it all going.
I don't know if so the universe doesn't give a shit. If this were so why so much interventions which occur to get people to 'wake up' and ascend from all of this?
When someone says that the universe does not care about humanity, that is wrong, it does because I do, but I also see why and how that caring came about.
Just for the sake of reference, is anyone interested in giving a description of how, or whether the Flyers and the Foreign Installation are at all connected? Seems some people refer to them as one and the same. Is this accurate?
smile. And the flyers should be off everybody's minds. :)
So when I say or read Foreign installation I mean it as the programming prevalent in the first attention, that has the effect of having people act out of integrity.
Just for the sake of reference, is anyone interested in giving a description of how, or whether the Flyers and the Foreign Installation are at all connected? Seems some people refer to them as one and the same. Is this accurate?
runningstream said:
The singularities ability " which again will not be surprised actually is non compliant within singular position or universe as stationary object " unfathomable unit appearing and dissappearing perhaps atomically
I kinda see the foreign installation as the hive and the flyers as the bees, coming out to roost.
However I do believe if you lead a spiritual life, one is not tasteful for the flyers. Inner silence, meditation, and detaching from the worldly things makes it more difficult for them to cling.
Agreed on all counts!
I see it like, after you raise your vibe to a certain level, they can't really stick, like you repel them, in a way.
I expect the flyers are happy now.
I expect the flyers are happy now.
I expect the flyers are happy now.
The FI can't be addressed directly. Think about this: why do you all come to this forum, or any forum? Because of the Foreign Installation.
If people are looking for entertainment or fun or especially an escape online, then I could say its the FI and they are susceptible to flyers. However, if they are looking for like minds and for some wisdom, then I would say this would not be related to the FI.
In my extended tonal family there is a high school art teacher, whom I have conversations with you guessed it, "art". Recently during one family gathering, I thought I may try to expand the conversation with her into the energetics of art, the state of mind, the artist is in, transfered to the art. Being an artist myself, and a seer, I know I instill in my art an energetic thrust, subtle energies if you like. Like a Stradivarius the maker instills something into it that a copy just cannot duplicate.
It's probably safe to say the flyer mind becomes our mind, and we have to work at removing it. I believe leading a spiritual life can do this.
I like the idea of changing assemblage point positions in respect to this.
The idea of love also -even if it doesn't fit in the current energies let's say expressed. It remains a key, doesn't it.
heart ...energy. Maybe the best source of Patience.
So would the first irreducible truth about flyers be that they survive, because of the ignorance of the host? For a start.
Being impeccable is quite distasteful to the fliers, also definitely following a path with a heart.
So would the first irreducible truth about flyers be that they survive, because of the ignorance of the host? For a start.
Nemo- with respect because I posted plenty lately,
I think you are that one that should answer this one.
_-_
Nikos I am more interested in others weighing in, than my answer.
A being then that lacks a specific knowledge, or just a being that is unaware?
Nikov said:
I think the flyer mind, the flyers as beings and the FI (which for me in the final analysis is one sort of a program or a pattern) doesn't follow us in the 'other world'.When we die or leave.
I think unawareness is a form of ignorance, but ignorance can also be ignoring the truth.
I believe that Awareness can be measured in the capacity to be aware of something, A sort of over arching awareness that grants sub divisions of awareness if you want to. Me for example, I can be completely unaware of something and yet be able to talk about it blindly, and somehow get exactly what I need to hear. For example I had a recent situation that I posted on the other forum, and I rambled and discussed feelings. Knot showed up and completely gave me the answers or knowledge or awareness I needed. And it brought me profound clarity. I am not even able to know what it is I am asking until and answer arises. I am almost able to compare levels of awareness if not the content of what I need but the intensity and am able to use that to see areas that I am lacking in.
Ahh thanks, yes the questions may not be that direct in nature, much like a river, the next thing to be brought into knowing, is the space empty, needing/requesting to be filled.
runningstream, that reminds of the story DJ said about some individuals are like gourds that have holes and they will always need someone to keep filling them.
So many insights!
I believe that Awareness can be measured in the capacity to be aware of something, A sort of over arching awareness that grants sub divisions of awareness if you want to. Me for example, I can be completely unaware of something and yet be able to talk about it blindly, and somehow get exactly what I need to hear. For example I had a recent situation that I posted on the other forum, and I rambled and discussed feelings. Knot showed up and completely gave me the answers or knowledge or awareness I needed. And it brought me profound clarity. I am not even able to know what it is I am asking until and answer arises. I am almost able to compare levels of awareness if not the content of what I need but the intensity and am able to use that to see areas that I am lacking in.
Nikos I am more interested in others weighing in, than my answer.
Fyi, this is how things work for me, I ask questions and the answers come to me. So knowledge, energetically speaking comes from the questions that are asked, and it need not be another human that answers it.
DJ Tales of Power:
"The moths are the heralds, or, better yet, the guardians of eternity," don Juan said after the sound had stopped. "For some reason, or for no reason at all, they are the depositories of the gold dust of eternity."
The metaphor was foreign to me. I asked him to explain it.
"The moths carry a dust on their wings," he said. "A dark gold dust. That dust is the dust of knowledge."
His explanation had made the metaphor even more obscure. I vacillated [* vacillate- be undecided about something; waver between conflicting positions or courses] for a moment, trying to find the best way of wording my question. But he began to talk again.
"Knowledge is a most peculiar affair," he said, "especially for a warrior. Knowledge for a warrior is something that comes at once, engulfs him, and passes on."
"What does knowledge have to do with the dust on the wings of moths?" I asked after a long pause.
"Knowledge comes floating like specks of gold dust; the same dust that covers the wings of moths. So, for a warrior, knowledge is like taking a shower, or being rained on by specks of dark gold dust."
Already dead , born again ?
:P But EK, No One went to so much trouble....
reminds me of a mistake I made years ago with a girl; I used to believe that I am a reincarnate of beings from the past and one of them was Bruce Lee, so I told this girl "I AM Bruce Lee". She Said : "really?" and I said "Yes really". What a mistake it was, to this day I don't know what are the consequences for it. I even tried to track her to tell her that I was wrong but it didn't help.
warriors strive for the truth - they are not dealing with ideas - truth exists as a conscious force of its own.
well then I bet you want to eat the cake and leave it whole too - how's that for an idea?
;D ::) ;)
;D ::) ;)