Author Topic: Listen.  (Read 127 times)

Offline Jennifer-

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Listen.
« on: December 08, 2007, 01:49:31 PM »
Listen. Trust the truth of your own inner language at least as much as you trust the syntax of any limited cognitive system. In such a manner you will become multilingual. Strive to corroborate the accuracy of your own inner hearing, and foster sobriety, so as to increase it. Honor your own inner language and your inner hearing. Practice continually. Test the truths you receive by contemplating their guidance with fidelity and compassion. Then, as with anything, continually reprise, distill, and refine your understanding.

Tunneshende, Merilyn
Without constant complete silence meditation - samadi - we lose ourselves in the game.  MM

erismoksha

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Re: Listen.
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2007, 02:50:03 AM »
Just reading some of this author's writings the other day, quite a bit of controversy surrounding Merilyn Tunneshende, as she is supposed to be another 'student' of Don Juan, and the 'actual' Nagual individual, because Carlos had failed. It's interesting to me how many other Naguals are branching out of Carlos's failure, and Don Juan students seem to pop up, still though, her writings are rather interesting, and the whole saga post-Castaneda, still is interesting of a story in itself to boot.

Offline Zamurito

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Re: Listen.
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2007, 02:55:57 AM »
It's interesting to me how many other Naguals are branching out of Carlos's failure..."

Was he a failure??
"Discipline is, indeed, the supreme joy of feeling reverent awe; of watching, with your mouth open, whatever is behind those secret doors."

Jahn

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Re: Listen.
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2007, 03:35:28 AM »
Was he a failure??

No.

But it depends on who's definition.
According to mine:
Carlos was the right guy in the right time frame that did the right thing.

Offline Zamurito

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Re: Listen.
« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2007, 03:45:31 AM »
No.

But it depends on who's definition.
According to mine:
Carlos was the right guy in the right time frame that did the right thing.

I agree with these words of yours Jahn.

It's always fascinated me the discussions that arise out of whether CC was successful, a failure, etc., etc.  Many seem to be like to a pit bull with lock-jaw when it comes to CC and what 'he' accomplished, or lack thereof...

I've found a great deal that resonated with me concerning what he shared with us, and I'm grateful that he did share. 

Eh, I've always been to busy working with what he shared on myself to ever be concerned with what 'he's' doing  ;)

z

"Discipline is, indeed, the supreme joy of feeling reverent awe; of watching, with your mouth open, whatever is behind those secret doors."

Jahn

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Re: Listen.
« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2007, 04:03:48 AM »
I agree with these words of yours Jahn.

It's always fascinated me the discussions that arise out of whether CC was successful, a failure, etc., etc.  Many seem to be like to a pit bull with lock-jaw when it comes to CC and what 'he' accomplished, or lack thereof...

I've found a great deal that resonated with me concerning what he shared with us, and I'm grateful that he did share. 

Eh, I've always been to busy working with what he shared on myself to ever be concerned with what 'he's' doing  ;)

z



Yes there is something for everyone in his books and when I return to them I always find something new and fresh to ponder for a while. Castaneda was not a complicated man but he got himself a complicated life.


Offline Quantum Shaman

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Re: Listen.
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2007, 04:32:43 AM »
Was he a failure??

I've never felt that CC was a failure on any level.  In fact, I think he was perhaps the most masterful stalker of this era.  The reason I say that is that I have every reason to believe that CC himself was/is Don Juan.  I could say that Don Juan was Carlos's double, and as those who have known me for awhile already know... that is pretty much what I have concluded.  What I DON'T know is whether CC was aware of this from the beginning, or whether it became apparent to him at some point, or if he ever figured it out at all.

The only reason this matters at this level of discussion is because I've always felt that CC was able to bring forth (manifest) that aspect of himself without any fear or concern for how "foolish" it made his humanform self (Castaneda) appear.  That's losing self-importance in a huge way!  And stalking oneself in the ultimate manifestation.

Carlos himself said he feared he would "fail" in his task to lead his party to freedom, and maybe it could be argued from THAT aspect that he "failed"... but I actually don't see it that way.  Any nagual is only capable of providing the tools and the guidance to his or her "party" - but it is always up to each individual as to how they will use those tools and whether they are willing or able to accept the guidance *from* a nagual or teacher or whatever word one chooses.  I feel that Carlos gave his party those tools - what they did with them was their own affair.

It's also been argued that CC didn't have enough "personal power" to lead his party to freedom, but again I'm not so sure that's the case.  When I really look at the man's life (what little is really known of it), what I *see* is someone who was genuinely a *seer*.  And as the quote goes:

Quote
Once a man learns to see he finds himself alone in the world with nothing but folly. Your acts, as well as the acts of your fellow men in general, appear to be important to you because you have learned to think they are important.

I have more or less concluded that CC found himself "alone in the world with nothing but folly" - up to and perhaps including those closest to him.  I have even wondered if perhaps he realized that his closest "apprentices" were largely only there out of infatuation with HIM, perhaps moreso than to further their own path.  Even in my own tiny, minor way, I have found that to be the case on occasion, and it is perhaps the most devastating blow of all - to realize that someone who has been pretending to be on the path is really only parroting your words out of some bizarre attempt to impress you.  Weird - damn weird!   :-\

But in the big picture...?  I don't think he was a failure at all.  Far from it.  If it weren't for CC, chances are we wouldn't be having this conversation.  So, like you, I'm glad he shared his Knowledge.

D
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Offline Michael

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Re: Listen.
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2007, 07:07:19 PM »
curious - failure is a funny word. no one is really in a position to make that judgement except Carlos himself.

but all the same, despite him getting these ideas to me, which is certainly a success from my perspective, i'd have to say outcomes look very questionable.

unfortunately i also have not spent that much time studying Carlos, and instead worked on his ideas in my own life. so i don't feel competent to make even a rough assessment. but i do have reservations about how he prosecuted his task, from the little I have gleaned of his life.

ask me after a few wines and I'd say he was a twit. but then I also have substantial reports which indicate a very astute man of wisdom. who knows? and who knows what his followers are doing now?

 

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