Topic: Why the toltec path is dark

[Firestarter]

I found the old post I wrote at loris thot Id bring it over here after talking to vicki about it.

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Tezcatlipoca was the Toltec and Aztec deity of sorcerers. One of his weapons was the obsidian mirror. Additionally, Ixtlán, or Ixtlán del Río, (per Journey to Ixtlan), means place where obsidian is found, or place of the obsidian knife.

But the main connection is, that Tezcatlipoca was the deity of the sorcerers, as was a sorcerer himself. He was also associated with the Night Sky, the Moon, lightning, . The obsidian mirror was used heavily for rituals to be able to scry and connect with spirit, get information and whatnot. But what the obsidian mirror does, effectively, is connect one to the unconscious self, connect with the nagual, and pull it into the subconscious, the 'middle ground' so one can access the spirit. "Lucid dreaming" for example, is a connection to the subconscious. Dreaming, is as well. If it is part of the unconscious, we would have no awareness. but when we're able to pull it at the threshhold then we have some access.

Sorcery is dark. Make no bones about that. Sorcery is dark - Tezcatlipoca was the deity of the sorcerers. People feared the sorcerers because they had power.

Tezcatlipoca had great power with his mirror. He even had the power to use it against Quetzacoatl, would be Tezcatlipoca's opposite, brother in spirit, but he was associated with venus, the morning and evening star, which is most visible at twilight, the sky, and wind. Venus is much more visible at this time, so its no wonder that during the time of twilight, the 'crack between the worlds,' that per the Toltec theme, which encompass these two deities, that we also have another theme with, a deity of 'knowledge' more than sorcery. Don Juan, however, was still noted as a sorcerer too. However, he put knowledge more as important than sorcery. However, he did walk Carlos through the whole shebang on the path so he would be able to know, all of it.

Tezcatlipoca is merely Quetzacoatl turned inside out. And any warrior et al, will understand these two 'sides' of themselves if made on the path, as a wo/man of knowledge and sorcerer. That from within they have their own versions of these two deities in their own way.

The power of the obsidian mirror and to scry as the Toltecs and Aztecs well knew, and anyone who scrys knows, is a way to reach the 'inner,' as one is looking into the black looking glass, they are connecting with a power of their own inner self. Which is thus connected to the infinite. "Dark" doesnt mean 'bad' and doesnt mean evil. But certainly when we get into the stuffings of it all, as any path of power can be, one can certainly be lead if they are foolish and fail the tests of Tezcatlipoca. He is also the god of 'deceit' or deception. His ability was strong in being able to 'smoke' his foes by putting them in the fog. Additionally, look at this from Fire From Within:

“I wanted him (don juan) to explain the fire and water techniques in greater detail. He said that the old seers’ knowledge was as intricate as it was useless and that he was only going to outline it.

Then he summarized the practices of above and below. The above dealt with secret knowledge about the wind, rain, sheets of lightning, clouds, thunder, daylight, and the sun. The knowledge of the below had to do with fog, water of underground springs, swamps, lightning bolts, earthquakes, the night, moonlight and the moon.”

There are stories from Mesoamerica when Tez would express his rage, he would hurl lightning bolts down, as well. "Fog" came from his mirror he wore on his foot to defeat his foes through the power of magic or deception, or illusion.

Per the toltec mythos, and the golden age of the Toltecs, Tez ended this grand time in Toltec history of their art and work, by defeating Quetzacoatl when he lead him to sin. "Black magic" was his forte, but the overall whole of the theme, was ending the more fruitful reign of the toltecs. Did toltecs see that somehow, this age when it ended, was cause they failed some quintessential 'test?' Would be unknown, or perhaps they saw things in cycles, such as when Quetzacoatl shows to defeat his brother and reign again, as of the myths of Quetzacoatl returning to the people.

Tez was also the deity of warriors, (esp young men). And of course we hear plenty about the warrior path. He would be the deity the warrior would meet at the crossroads and be tested by. If pass the test, Tez would reward. If failed, Tez would punish considerably. Is it no wonder then, that don juan spoke heavily about the necessity to be 'impeccable?' Like his own 'codex' of sorts the warrior path, of impeccability was necessary for survival. The warrior for the toltec of more modern day, is to burn from the fire from within, dart past eagle, be free.

Now as Tez was a terribly difficult deity to contend with, is it no wonder, don juan spoke extensively of 'breaking the mirror of self reflection?' If the obsidian mirror, could connect one to their own nagual, but still, could be used against the sorcerer in various ways (tricked ultimately) then could it be quite possible, he was speaking of breaking an obsidian mirror in some form? Interesting to think about.

[Firestarter]

This is from Divine Hunger: Cannibalism as a Cultural Symbol By Peggy Reeves Sanday:

“As it is told and related that many times during the life of Quetzacoatl  certain sorcerers attempted to shame him into making human offerings into sacrificing humans. But he would not consent. He would not comply, because he greatly loved his subjects who were Toltecs. The offerings he made were always snakes, birds, and butterflies. And it is related, they say, that he thereby angered the sorcerers, so that they took to mocking and taunting him. And the sorcerers asserted and willed that Quetzacoatl be vexed and put to flight.

Then they tell how Quetzacoatl departed: it was when he refused the sorcerers’ decree that he make human offerings, that he sacrifice humans. Thereupon the sorcerers deliberated among themselves, they whose names were Tezcatlipoca, Ihuitmecatl, and Toltecatl. “He must leave his city, for we shall live here,” they said. And they said “Let us make pulque [Note from wiki: In the Aztec pantheon of deities, pulque production was represented by the god of pulque, Tepoztecatl, and the gods of drunkenness, such as Macuil-Tochtli or Five Rabbit and Ometochtli or Two Rabbit, both part of the pantheon of Centzon Totochtin, the four hundred rabbit gods of drunkenness.]. We will have him drink it, to corrupt him, so that he will no longer perform the sacraments.”

And then Tezcatlipoca said, “I, I say we must give him his body to see!” . . .Tezcatlipoca went first, carrying a two-sided mirror the size of an outstretched hand, concealed in wrapping.
In Tezcatlopica’s mirror Quetzacoatl sees his own evil: “The eye-lids were greatly swollen, the eye sockets deeply sunk, the face must distended all over and bilious.” Shocked at his image, Quetzacoatl goes into refuge and has a mask made to cover his face. Looking again in the mirror, he is pleased with his new image and comes out of refuge. The sorcerers then got Quetzacoatl drunk with pulque and in this state he has a sexual encounter with his sister, a high priestess. When he wakes from this, he is heartbroken and realizing his authority has been betrayed, he leaves Tollan, with the result the city falls. When he left Tollan, he promised to return and reestablish his kingdom. The rulers of Tenochtitlan were aware of this prophecy and awaited his return to claim the kingship.

The confrontation between Tezcatlipoca and Quetzacoatl in this scenario illustrates the Aztec belief that the cosmos were not perfectly balanced between elements representing chaos and those representing peace and order. In this scenario, Brundage suggests, the Aztec thinker was expressing his belief that the ‘inexplicability of God exceeds his resources of justice.” The figure of Tezcatlipoca represents his passion and untrammeled will, which were, in the Aztec view, just as necessary for living as was Quetzacoatl the priest, with his penances and his wisdom. In other words, there is a time when the ambivalent nature of the human spirit emphasizes the dark as opposed to the light, the objective experience of evil as opposed to the subjective knowledge of it….The tempting and being tempted, Both Tezcatlipoca and Quetzacoatl show an awareness of the human participation of the cosmic dimensions of chaos. The mirror and the drunkenness indicate the knowledge that evil is internal as well as external and part of human interaction. The story of Quetzacoatl’s fall, like the Adamic myth, portrays evil as residing within the actions of humans and as distinct from good.”

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The purpose of sorcerery if used effectively is to face more of our own shadowy aspects which do exist. "Evil" however, a loaded word which can be pushed and pulled in various directions, is more related to acts than anything else.

There were two Quetzacoatl's in Toltec lore: the priest and ruler of the golden age, as well as the deity himself, the Plumed Serpent. The 'good guy' of the story, verses the 'bad guy' of the story, Tezcatlipoca.

But getting pasts the myths and the lore of it all, if we were able to imbed these two brothers into a 'person,' we have an interesting polarity, not unlike Jesus and Satan, or Buddha and Mara, or various other stories when the golden god of light, faces off with the god of darkness. But additionally, stripping down to this, we see in humankind the propensity for mankind to do good works, or evil/harmful, or violent works. But ignorance or deception is the ticket.

Quetzacoatl's error in the story, whence facing the mirror which showed his 'face,' or really, an 'inner face' of a self which wasnt as glorious as he would've liked, he made the error of running off, and then, finding a mask which would be more suitable, so he could face the mirror. However, this wasnt the solution. Additionally, becoming 'drunk' is even something we do see every day. Go into any bar or nightclub and see many people drinking, which they are simply avoiding reality and life. Making themselves worse, not better. Which of course drunkenness can cause one to let their own guards down, show their 'crap' and stupidity in front of all, however, the drunk one will be completely unaware of how grotesque they appear. Like the story of Dr Jeckyll and Mister Hyde - similar premise. The doctor was doing his own chemistry work, and changing more and more into this Hyde. His aim was to 'separate' Hyde and give him the ability to roam free, while he 'slept' because he was becoming too powerful. Its a simple story of one, not waking up from their dream, (not dreaming as in the work), and what the price may be if one refuses to acknowledge, their own dream, and face their own face. The 'face' will not be, always, what we would like to see. We may have several. But there is still one, which must be acknowledged. One that has the imprint of the cosmos on it, that the cosmic battle of good and evil has been fought on. That would be the face that Quetzacoatl saw, in Tez's mirror. It could've been, per choices he made - a grand time for him to be able to face more truth, and heal from it. Instead, through his own shame, he ran off, which was the other error, for this allowed the free reign of the shadow over the land. And of course, what he 'knew' in his heart, wasnt the solution - the sacrifice of human beings to appease the gods. For then, per the Aztec myth, the story of Montezuma and his own regrets and remourse, for giving way to such a thing, as he would reflect back to the story of the toltecs about Quetzacoatl. Give Hyde free reign cause he demands it, and suddenly, one is left standing on violent ground, and then later on, desolation.

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Does this make sorcerery a 'bad' thing? No, but the story does say, what sorcery can lead one too. Sorcerery can lead one to, the mirror. The mirror and what is seen isnt the problem. Its the reactions to the mirror that can save oneself, or damn oneself.

[Jahn]

If you want to know more about The Smoky Mirror "Tezcatlipoca" then read Don Miguel.

Folklore has obviously made him to what he was not and the Aztecs had the most thing wrong in their religion. In terms of today one would say that the Aztec regime was a terror regime and when Cortéz came along he could easily find associates among other indian tribes that were occupied by the Aztecs.

The Mirror is the Mirror of God because in every man you can find God. That is what Tezcatlipoca message is all about. I am - you are too.

Among the Aztecs there lived Toltecs. The Toltecs was called for when there should be great sacred ceremonies or dancing events. You would say that the Toltec tribe within the Aztec society was the spiritual and cultural group while the Aztec indians were the mundane rulers, alas with a religious and astrological setup.

Toltec means men with knowledge. (Men=man or woman).
And the Toltecs used the sacred sites for transformation purposes. Don Juans lineage was Toltec.

[Ke-ke wan]

If you want to know more about The Smoky Mirror "Tezcatlipoca" then read Don Miguel.

Folklore has obviously made him to what he was not and the Aztecs had the most thing wrong in their religion. In terms of today one would say that the Aztec regime was a terror regime and when Cortéz came along he could easily find associates among other indian tribes that were occupied by the Aztecs.

The Mirror is the Mirror of God because in every man you can find God. That is what Tezcatlipoca message is all about. I am - you are too.

Among the Aztecs there lived Toltecs. The Toltecs was called for when there should be great sacred ceremonies or dancing events. You would say that the Toltec tribe within the Aztec society was the spiritual and cultural group while the Aztec indians were the mundane rulers, alas with a religious and astrological setup.

Toltec means men with knowledge. (Men=man or woman).
And the Toltecs used the sacred sites for transformation purposes. Don Juans lineage was Toltec.

Thank you for this brief, but thoroughly informative explanation Jamir!