Author Topic: Spirits  (Read 534 times)

Offline Michael

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Spirits
« on: July 22, 2006, 08:49:12 PM »
everything is spirit
has many layers of significance
but always alive

everything is alive.

one of the hardest and first lessons on this path, the recognition that we exist in an alive world.

and that world is agglutinated - every agglutination has its own unique spirit:
your car has a spirit by dint of its agglutinated appearance - it is an inherent quality in an object. take a pile of dirt, it has an astral counterpart. shape that pile, make a thing of beauty that lasts for ages, and there you find a deep and complex spirit.

but there exists a crossbeam, which is awareness, a special quality of vivification, with potential threads of self-awareness. that’s how we see it. a vast landscape of beings that merge into each other, but some have a fiery quality of energy, as a solid core of light - we call these living creatures, some organic, some not.

among these there is a superfine group, who connect to the beam of self-awareness.

there are inanimate objects, which have inherent spirits, and when they are old or rare, they can be merged with an aware spirit of the inorganic type - that is exactly our situation. we have a body, and what we would call our I resides inside this body, an inorganic driving an organic spirit.

it is very important to know the difference in dreaming and in waking. some spirits are shells, and some have energetic essence, and some have injected energy with no autonomous essence. so too some things are forceful, but not true.  some people are hollow, and some are springs. know the difference, when you see the light of awareness, that is our ticket.

spirits are everywhere. mass opinions are spirits, living off the minds of humans. so the view that we are unique independent self-directed and free individuals, is a spirit, who happens to come from Europe, and has spread. it existed in Asia, but under a different purpose. your family’s common political allegiance is also a spirit.

spirits control us, they feed for life off every emotion. and so do we, who as indwelling spirits. but we need to take control of the ship - this is where the battles of the spirits inside us play out, as we strive for the ability to say, “I can change my life.”.  no longer one of those endless people - who crap on about all manner of spiritual dialogues, but are unable to change their horse’s nature even if they solemnly believed they should - who are powerless over themselves.

bad spirits - please just don’t go there, things are hard enough without their nightmares. naturally in healing we have no choice, but that is tolerable. To invite curiosity about bad spirits is idiocy - just walk out, close the door behind.

but how to tell a bad one? this is really a very important skill, let me tell you from experience, i wish i had seen some for what they were a lot sooner - you must know, our tribe are attracted to bright objects - it’s in our nature...  One particularly bad experience, where i acquired a conch shell in circumstances i can only describe as bazaar in the extreme.  that should have been a dead give-away, Julie knew, but i was in love with the conch.  I had eventually to dispose of this after a long string of things going wrong, but it was a lesson for me. i’ve had to learn that one a few times now! anyway my remedy worked immediately, that’s the important thing - not just recognising a bummer, but knowing how to dispense with it as slickly as possible.

good ones... oh me oh my could we not rave, there is so much out there.

mostly when we talk of spirits in external operational terminology, we are referring to those that inhabit places, locals, and archetypes, but most interesting are the nature spirits that inhabit places of power. these are the ones shamans commonly dance with.  they can be found in creeks and trees and mountains, and in old places of significance, like temples, caves, hill tops, rings etc. they can also be found inside us, but most virile humans like a full on experience.  there are centre hub places for different types of energy... most interesting subject.

in the end, i personally am of the opinion that the best are the spirits of freedom. especially that bird. for these we have to sacrifice the cheaper time fillers.

the spirits of silence, they are to be acknowledged, they open the cosmic landscape of silence, that we can almost just walk into. they are subtle, fine. waiting like vultures, to rip out my heads. lying there like a soft naked woman, to receive me as i let go all that stuff, and sink into her flesh of silence.

m

Offline Jennifer-

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2007, 09:48:25 PM »
everything is spirit
has many layers of significance
but always alive

everything is alive.

one of the hardest and first lessons on this path, the recognition that we exist in an alive world.

and that world is agglutinated - every agglutination has its own unique spirit:
your car has a spirit by dint of its agglutinated appearance - it is an inherent quality in an object. take a pile of dirt, it has an astral counterpart. shape that pile, make a thing of beauty that lasts for ages, and there you find a deep and complex spirit.

but there exists a crossbeam, which is awareness, a special quality of vivification, with potential threads of self-awareness. that’s how we see it. a vast landscape of beings that merge into each other, but some have a fiery quality of energy, as a solid core of light - we call these living creatures, some organic, some not.

among these there is a superfine group, who connect to the beam of self-awareness.

there are inanimate objects, which have inherent spirits, and when they are old or rare, they can be merged with an aware spirit of the inorganic type - that is exactly our situation. we have a body, and what we would call our I resides inside this body, an inorganic driving an organic spirit.

it is very important to know the difference in dreaming and in waking. some spirits are shells, and some have energetic essence, and some have injected energy with no autonomous essence. so too some things are forceful, but not true.  some people are hollow, and some are springs. know the difference, when you see the light of awareness, that is our ticket.

spirits are everywhere. mass opinions are spirits, living off the minds of humans. so the view that we are unique independent self-directed and free individuals, is a spirit, who happens to come from Europe, and has spread. it existed in Asia, but under a different purpose. your family’s common political allegiance is also a spirit.

spirits control us, they feed for life off every emotion. and so do we, who as indwelling spirits. but we need to take control of the ship - this is where the battles of the spirits inside us play out, as we strive for the ability to say, “I can change my life.”.  no longer one of those endless people - who crap on about all manner of spiritual dialogues, but are unable to change their horse’s nature even if they solemnly believed they should - who are powerless over themselves.

bad spirits - please just don’t go there, things are hard enough without their nightmares. naturally in healing we have no choice, but that is tolerable. To invite curiosity about bad spirits is idiocy - just walk out, close the door behind.

but how to tell a bad one? this is really a very important skill, let me tell you from experience, i wish i had seen some for what they were a lot sooner - you must know, our tribe are attracted to bright objects - it’s in our nature...  One particularly bad experience, where i acquired a conch shell in circumstances i can only describe as bazaar in the extreme.  that should have been a dead give-away, Julie knew, but i was in love with the conch.  I had eventually to dispose of this after a long string of things going wrong, but it was a lesson for me. i’ve had to learn that one a few times now! anyway my remedy worked immediately, that’s the important thing - not just recognising a bummer, but knowing how to dispense with it as slickly as possible.

good ones... oh me oh my could we not rave, there is so much out there.

mostly when we talk of spirits in external operational terminology, we are referring to those that inhabit places, locals, and archetypes, but most interesting are the nature spirits that inhabit places of power. these are the ones shamans commonly dance with.  they can be found in creeks and trees and mountains, and in old places of significance, like temples, caves, hill tops, rings etc. they can also be found inside us, but most virile humans like a full on experience.  there are centre hub places for different types of energy... most interesting subject.

in the end, i personally am of the opinion that the best are the spirits of freedom. especially that bird. for these we have to sacrifice the cheaper time fillers.

the spirits of silence, they are to be acknowledged, they open the cosmic landscape of silence, that we can almost just walk into. they are subtle, fine. waiting like vultures, to rip out my heads. lying there like a soft naked woman, to receive me as i let go all that stuff, and sink into her flesh of silence.

m


Just dusting off some older posts...
Without constant complete silence meditation - samadi - we lose ourselves in the game.  MM

Offline Jennifer-

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2007, 10:48:51 PM »
 ;)
Without constant complete silence meditation - samadi - we lose ourselves in the game.  MM

Offline Nick

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2008, 01:16:48 PM »
Thought it needed some more dusting, and some thoughts.
spirits are everywhere. mass opinions are spirits, living off the minds of humans. so the view that we are unique independent self-directed and free individuals, is a spirit, who happens to come from Europe, and has spread. it existed in Asia, but under a different purpose. your family’s common political allegiance is also a spirit.

spirits control us, they feed for life off every emotion. and so do we, who as indwelling spirits. but we need to take control of the ship - this is where the battles of the spirits inside us play out, as we strive for the ability to say, “I can change my life.”.  no longer one of those endless people - who crap on about all manner of spiritual dialogues, but are unable to change their horse’s nature even if they solemnly believed they should - who are powerless over themselves.

mostly when we talk of spirits in external operational terminology, we are referring to those that inhabit places, locals, and archetypes, but most interesting are the nature spirits that inhabit places of power. these are the ones shamans commonly dance with.  they can be found in creeks and trees and mountains, and in old places of significance, like temples, caves, hill tops, rings etc. they can also be found inside us, but most virile humans like a full on experience.  there are centre hub places for different types of energy... most interesting subject.

in the end, i personally am of the opinion that the best are the spirits of freedom. especially that bird. for these we have to sacrifice the cheaper time fillers.

the spirits of silence, they are to be acknowledged, they open the cosmic landscape of silence, that we can almost just walk into. they are subtle, fine. waiting like vultures, to rip out my heads. lying there like a soft naked woman, to receive me as i let go all that stuff, and sink into her flesh of silence.

m


I am currently reading a book called "Breaking the Spell" Religion as a Natural Phenomenon, by Daniel C. Dennett. Interesting thoughts, but funny thing about scientists they don't bring spirit-ual possibilities into their considerations until they have absolutely no choice left, and then they have to rename it and try to make it more exact, specific, and more their own idea.

But it brings up an interesting concept, that of the meme, as basically ideas that evolve and use us to fight for survival. It makes clear, that "of course" an idea doesn't have the power to actually fight for survival, just as "obviously" a virus has no ability to fight for its survival, it just latches on to its host. This of course is similar to what you are saying about them feeding off of us to survive. A lot of interesting stuff about the evolution of these ideas throughout history that when translated into the language of spirituality the ideas they are presenting actually make more sense in some ways.

Also reminded me of the book by Niel Gaimen called American Gods, which had the idea of the Gods as being living spirits but created by us, like powerful thought-forms, and we give them our power through our worship of and paying attention to them. We brought the spirits and gods with us when we came to America. Of course the book also mentions that spirits that were already here, and the main characters journey to get a feather from a thunderbird. It felt to me like there was power in this book. It made me think about how the spirits are every where esp. how there could be the strangest spirits, it stretched my imagination of what spirits might be like.

The sciency book also made me think of what happened to the ideas/spirits of early Christianity in the sense of sperm. The "seeds" that were sent out dispersed and only some survived to inseminate the minds of the people for the long run...until now of course with the revival of the ancient ways. Wonder what spiritual forces brought on this second insemination (second cum-ing...lol)?

The sexual and the spiritual...
"As long as we confuse the myriad forms of the divine lila with reality, without perceiving the unity of Brahman underlying all these forms, we are under the spell of maya..."
 -Fritjof Capra, The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism

Offline Michael

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2008, 02:09:28 PM »
important to know the difference between spirits that have energetic essence, and those which are constructs of humans or other beings. Constructs are simply shells, but can be filled with a lot of power.

Like when you see a person in dream, how to know when they are reflections of our inner self, or real separate entities, and then are they who they appear to be? 


Offline Nick

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2008, 03:52:51 PM »
important to know the difference between spirits that have energetic essence, and those which are constructs of humans or other beings. Constructs are simply shells, but can be filled with a lot of power.

Like when you see a person in dream, how to know when they are reflections of our inner self, or real separate entities, and then are they who they appear to be? 



yes, yes, I have been pondering this, very interesting. I had a dream of you once, somehow I know it was just my own minds construct or at least that it wasn't the real you, something was missing. Felt too two dimensional, like to flat, it was missing some sort of juice you feel when something is living....at least I knew somehow it wasn't you. Can we see the reflection of the how or where it was created in it if we can see in that way. Can we see our own reflection in it we have created it. And how to differentiate between our own projection of self onto the spirit and the actual spirit. we always project and identify, see what we think we see.....

another thing I have been pondering, is it possible for a spirit that is a construct of humans or other beings to somehow, maybe if it lives long enough somehow get an energetic essence? even Pinocchio became a real boy, lol.

« Last Edit: July 18, 2008, 03:55:59 PM by Nai »
"As long as we confuse the myriad forms of the divine lila with reality, without perceiving the unity of Brahman underlying all these forms, we are under the spell of maya..."
 -Fritjof Capra, The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism

Offline Michael

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2008, 11:58:08 PM »
is it possible for a spirit that is a construct of humans or other beings to somehow, maybe if it lives long enough somehow get an energetic essence? even Pinocchio became a real boy, lol.

who can say what can happen, but I doubt it myself. I have met in astral extremely powerful figures who were shells, and yet they had power far beyond me - instilled by devotees for thousands of years.

When speaking of these 'shells' it is not so easy to be clear. Take the Indian gods who I have explored. Are they shells or manifestations of human desires, or real with energetic essence? I would have said many years ago, that they are projections of inner archetypes in the human subconscious. Now I say they are that, but also more - they come to me as individuated beings. And are they in Australia as well as India? Well I don't believe so, except by a special 'link'.

Their philosophical aspects will always be available anywhere, but their unique energy seems only available in India. And yet I know they go beyond that, and manifest in Australia or US or anywhere. But it's not the same - in India they have a presence which is absolutely extraordinary. They will walk up to you in the street, even touch you - Julie has been touched twice by gods in India.

It is such a mystery, one can only roll with it, and say, anything is possible in this universe.

nichi

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2008, 01:31:33 AM »
I've always thought that "the Christ" and "the devil" were both examples of beings who gained independent energy through the momentum of people's attributions and imputations to them.  I'm re-evaluating that idea these days. Though "the devil" does come to be a catch-all concept, it seems.

They feel very different to me than "Shiva" or "Kali". But I believe what you're saying, M, about needing to be in India to have a full appreciation therein.

The "empty shell" concept is most driven home to me by 'tulpas'. I had one of those once, and I assumed he would just fade away through my own neglect. But if I tune into him, I sense that he is still about, consorting with his own kind. (In his case, centaurs.)

But this brings up another question: did I really 'create' him, or did I simply perceive him out of the flotsam and jetsam around me?

Interesting topic, Jen!
« Last Edit: July 19, 2008, 01:40:11 AM by nichi »

tangerine dream

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2008, 02:46:34 AM »

But this brings up another question: did I really 'create' him, or did I simply perceive him out of the flotsam and jetsam around me?




This is a good question.  Can we ever really create anything?  Or is everything already here just waiting for us to become aware?  How do we know for sure? 

nichi

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2008, 03:26:13 AM »
This is a good question.  Can we ever really create anything?  Or is everything already here just waiting for us to become aware?  How do we know for sure? 


Yes, good stuff for chewing!

Jahn

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2008, 04:34:29 AM »
This is a good question.  Can we ever really create anything?   Or is everything already here just waiting for us to become aware?  How do we know for sure? 


This has already been discussed. In pure energy terms we cannot create a iota but we can change existing energy - that is the same as to manifest. We can build a house or give birth to a child or a demon. The house was a brick of walls and a stack of lumber before it became a house. So in strict energy terms we do not create, the energy that created the house was already there -(in termsof bricks and lumber)  we only transform it and our money pay the carpenters. Food gives nourishment to the unborn child, while depression and nightmares gives energy to the demon.

tangerine dream

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2008, 11:31:52 AM »
This has already been discussed. In pure energy terms we cannot create a iota but we can change existing energy - that is the same as to manifest. We can build a house or give birth to a child or a demon. The house was a brick of walls and a stack of lumber before it became a house. So in strict energy terms we do not create, the energy that created the house was already there -

Exactly.

  :-*

 ;D

« Last Edit: July 19, 2008, 11:58:32 AM by bluebird »

erik

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2008, 02:04:36 PM »
I've always thought that "the Christ" and "the devil" were both examples of beings who gained independent energy through the momentum of people's attributions and imputations to them.

How about Yeshua?

Offline Nick

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2008, 02:50:52 PM »
This has already been discussed. In pure energy terms we cannot create a iota but we can change existing energy - that is the same as to manifest. We can build a house or give birth to a child or a demon. The house was a brick of walls and a stack of lumber before it became a house. So in strict energy terms we do not create, the energy that created the house was already there -(in termsof bricks and lumber)  we only transform it and our money pay the carpenters. Food gives nourishment to the unborn child, while depression and nightmares gives energy to the demon.

I like the way you put it but I am reluctant to draw strict conclusions about anything spirit or energy. With a world of infinity and eternity, and just as many possible dimensions of experience; AP positions, who is this little me to say what is what with absolute certainty?
As Michael put it: who can say what can happen, but I doubt it myself.

Yeshua, I'm assuming you mean one of the names for Jesus? I don't know but here is more food for thought along those lines, and I would love to here what you think about Yeshua, including why you choose that name?

"Christ and human evolution

Steiner describes Christ's being and mission on earth as having a central place in human evolution:[49]

    The being of Christ is central to all religions, though called by different names by each.
    Every religion is valid and true for the time and cultural context in which it was born.
    Historical forms of Christianity need to be transformed considerably in our times in order to meet the on-going evolution of humanity.

It is the being that unifies all religions — and not a particular religious faith — that Steiner saw as the central force in human evolution. He understood Christ's incarnation as a historical reality, and a pivotal point in human history, however. The "Christ Being" is for Steiner not only the Redeemer of the Fall from Paradise, but also the unique pivot and meaning of earth's "evolutionary" processes and of all human history. [49] The essence of being "Christian" is, for Steiner, a search for balance between polarizing extremes[50] and the ability to manifest love in freedom.[10]" Wikipedia

Divergence from conventional Christian thought

Steiner's views of Christianity diverge from conventional Christian thought in key places, and include gnostic elements.[51] One of the central points of divergence is found in Steiner's views on reincarnation and karma.

Steiner also posited two different Jesus children involved in the Incarnation of the Christ: one child descended from Solomon, as described in the Gospel of Matthew; the other child from Nathan, as described in the Gospel of Luke.[40] (The genealogies given in the two gospels diverge some thirty generations before Jesus' birth.)

Steiner's view of the second coming of Christ is also unusual. He suggested that this would not be a physical reappearance, but rather, meant that the Christ being would become manifest in non-physical form, in the "etheric realm" — i.e. visible to spiritual vision and apparent in community life — for increasing numbers of people, beginning around the year 1933. He emphasized that the future would require humanity to recognize this Spirit of Love in all its genuine forms, regardless of how this is named. He also warned that the traditional name, "Christ", might be used, yet the true essence of this Being of Love ignored. Wikipedia

This is something I have begun researching with avid interest.
"As long as we confuse the myriad forms of the divine lila with reality, without perceiving the unity of Brahman underlying all these forms, we are under the spell of maya..."
 -Fritjof Capra, The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism

nichi

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Re: Spirits
« Reply #14 on: July 19, 2008, 10:12:32 PM »
How about Yeshua?

Could you clarify the distinction?
« Last Edit: July 19, 2008, 10:41:25 PM by nichi »

 

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