Topic: Knowledge of the Higher Worlds and Attainment

[Firestarter]

I'm almost finished with it, came across an interesting part in chapter 8.

"In certain respects, the soul is actually outside the part of the human being, the so-called physical body which in waking life is the medium for sense perceptions and thought. The soul is then only connected with the finer bodies (the etheric body and the astral body), which are beyond the scope of physical sense observation. But this activity of these finer bodies does not cease during sleep. Just as the physical body is connected and lives with the things and beings of the physical world, affecting them and being affected by them, so, too, does the soul live in a higher world; only, this life of the soul continues during sleep. The soul is in full activity during sleep, but we can know nothing of this activity so long as we have no spiritual organs of perception through which to observe what is going on around us to see what we ourselves are doing during sleep, as we observe our daily physical environment with our ordinary senses."

I should be past this issue. But even though I am well aware of the double, as in truth, that is what I get my information from, messages, or even controls the pendulum I use. Still though, why can I have difficulty with the soul not within my being itself? I know we are multi-faceted. But why have I never got past this issue?

I am not sure.

[Firestarter]

Yes!

"Man must become a partaker of the spirit in order to carry its revelations into the physical world. He transforms the earth by implanting in it that he has ascertained in the spiritual world. That is his task. It is only because the physical world is dependent upon the spiritual, and because man can work upon earth, in a true sense, only if he is a participator in those worlds in which the creative forces lie concealed only for these reasons should he have the desire to ascend to higher worlds. No one approaching esoteric training with these sentiments and resolved not to deviate for a moment from these prescribed directions, need fear the slightest danger. No one should allow the prospect of these dangers to deter him from esoteric training; it should rather act as a strong challenge to one and all to acquire those faculties which every truly esoteric student must possess."

[Firestarter]

This is interesting to read per the current collective chaos. And surely Steiner lived at a chaotic time.

"The more capable he is of meeting the demands made by the outer world upon a healthy, sound constitution of body, soul and spirit, the better it is for him. On the other hand, it may be very bad for him if his ordinary waking life affects him in an exciting or irritating way, that is, if destructive or hampering influences of outer life affect him in addition to the great changes taking place in his inner self. He must seek to find everything corresponding to his powers and faculties which can lead him into undisturbed, harmonious communion with his surroundings, while avoiding everything detrimental to this harmony everything that brings unrest and feverish haste into his life. And here it is not so much a question of casting off this unrest and haste in an external sense, but much more of taking care that thoughts, feelings, intentions, and bodily health are not thereby exposed to continual fluctuation."

[Firestarter]

Ugh. As Dramatica and I want out but we know this is true:

"He observes how before this birth he wove the causes which necessarily led to his return into life. Henceforth he knows that being within himself, which is fashioned with all its imperfections in the visible world, and which can only be brought to its final perfection in this same visible world. For in no other world is an opportunity given to build up and complete this being. Moreover, he recognizes that death cannot sever him forever from this world; for he says to himself: 'Once I came into this world because, being what I was, I needed the life it provided to acquire qualities unattainable in any other world. And I must remain bound to this world until I have developed within myself everything that can here be gained. I shall someday become a useful collaborator in another world only by acquiring all the requisite faculties in this physical world."

[Firestarter]

OOF. Just finished. Now learned plenty new, but when I get to the end, and I am reading on the Greater Guardian of the Threshhold. It comes together, what I suspected. Why so many of the NDEers are told to go back. Why all this reincarnation? Why the bodhisattva? That world obviously wants to keep sending us here, to help the liberation of other beings.

Of course, this makes sense. Say you liberate yourself, and go no further to aid others in any way. Why should that being cross the threshold? If they know what they know or have acquired power, and they also know the detriment to human beings if they do not seek true liberation?

Now course, i know looking at humanity right now, the forces that be are doing all they can to make slaves of humanity. I am aware, that many spiritualists, who are free, at least, in the inner sense, do need to try to point to folks at least, to wake up and seek liberation. Stop wasting time. If all the liberated folks, just sat on hands and did nothing, then dark forces would win, I suspect.

But sure, there is an energy in me that is TIRED. I really, do not want to come back here again. So sure, I want to do what must be done, cross threshold, get eagles gift, whatever. I want it done this life.

[Firestarter]

Now this is interesting. I did ask AI a couple questions on Steiner. It is kind of funny what AI says on nourishing the body, soul, spirit, and how it applies to today.

can you tell me some of the philosophy of Rudolph Steiner?

ChatGPT said:
Yes! Rudolf Steiner (1861–1925) was an Austrian philosopher, esotericist, and the founder of Anthroposophy, a spiritual philosophy that blends Western esotericism, Goethean science, and Christian mysticism. His ideas influenced education (Waldorf schools), biodynamic farming, medicine, and the arts.

Here are some key aspects of his philosophy:

1. Anthroposophy: Spiritual Science
Steiner described Anthroposophy as a path of knowledge that seeks to unite the spiritual and material worlds.

He believed that humans can develop higher faculties of perception through meditation, inner discipline, and moral development.

2. Threefold Human Nature
Steiner saw humans as having body, soul, and spirit, each requiring distinct forms of nourishment and development.

The soul acts as the mediator between the physical body and the higher, immortal spirit.

3. Karma and Reincarnation
He adapted ideas from Theosophy, teaching that each human undergoes multiple incarnations.

Our actions in one life shape our karma, influencing our future destinies and spiritual evolution.

4. The Evolution of Consciousness
Steiner proposed that human consciousness has evolved through different historical epochs.

He divided history into seven major cultural periods, each shaping human thought and spiritual development.

5. Threefold Social Order
He envisioned an ideal society with three independent but harmonious spheres:

Spiritual (Culture & Education) – Free from state or economic control.

Legal (Politics & Rights) – Ensuring equality and justice.

Economic (Work & Production) – Based on cooperation rather than competition.

6. Education and Waldorf Schools
Steiner founded Waldorf education, emphasizing creativity, imagination, and holistic development.

He believed education should nurture the body, soul, and spirit, tailoring learning to a child's developmental stages.

7. Biodynamic Agriculture
A spiritual-ecological farming method that considers the cosmos, soil health, and plant life as an interconnected system.

Farmers use special preparations (e.g., cow horns filled with manure buried in the soil) to enhance soil vitality.

8. Spiritual Science & Clairvoyance
Steiner claimed to access higher spiritual knowledge through clairvoyant perception.

He described the Akashic Records, a cosmic archive containing all human experiences.

9. Christian Mysticism & Christ as a Cosmic Being
Unlike traditional Christianity, Steiner taught that Christ was a cosmic force who brought a new spiritual impulse to humanity.

He saw the Mystery of Golgotha (Crucifixion & Resurrection) as a pivotal event in cosmic evolution.

10. Eurythmy: Spiritual Movement Art
A dance-like art form expressing spiritual principles through movement.

Used in Waldorf schools and therapeutic settings.

Steiner’s teachings are complex but deeply mystical, blending esoteric wisdom with practical applications. Does any of this resonate with you? 😊







You said:
can you elaborate how he said to nourish body, soul and spirit?

ChatGPT said:
Yes! Rudolf Steiner emphasized that the body, soul, and spirit each require distinct forms of nourishment for a balanced and harmonious life. His approach integrates spiritual science, practical life, and inner development.

1. Nourishing the Body: Physical and Life Forces
Steiner saw the human body as not just a material structure but a living organism connected to cosmic forces. He believed physical health was deeply tied to rhythms of nature, nutrition, and movement.

Nutrition & Biodynamic Farming

He advocated for natural, organic, and biodynamic food to maintain vitality.

Food should be grown with cosmic rhythms in mind (e.g., moon cycles influencing plant growth).

Processed foods and artificial chemicals were seen as weakening life forces.

Movement & Rhythm

He emphasized rhythms in daily life—mealtimes, sleep, work, and play should follow natural cycles.

He developed Eurythmy, a movement art that aligns the body with spiritual principles.

Walking in nature, gardening, and conscious movement (rather than mechanical exercise) were ideal for bodily nourishment.

Healing & Medicine

He founded Anthroposophical Medicine, which combines spiritual insight with natural remedies.

Special herbal and homeopathic remedies work not just on symptoms but on the whole person.

He saw illness as an imbalance between body, soul, and spirit that should be treated holistically.

2. Nourishing the Soul: Emotions, Art, and Inner Balance
The soul acts as the bridge between the body and spirit. Steiner believed the soul could be strengthened through art, emotional balance, and self-reflection.

The Power of Art

He saw art as a soul-nourishing force that awakens higher emotions.

Music, painting, sculpture, storytelling, and poetry should be experienced regularly.

The colors, shapes, and sounds we surround ourselves with affect our inner world.

Emotional and Psychological Well-being

He emphasized cultivating inner calm and harmony through self-awareness.

Overindulgence in material distractions (e.g., too much entertainment, loud noise, superficial emotions) could drain the soul.

He recommended inner silence, meditation, and self-reflection to maintain emotional balance.

Education & Learning as Soul Nourishment

He designed Waldorf Education to feed the soul, using storytelling, myth, and artistic activities.

He warned against mechanical, abstract thinking too early in life, advocating for age-appropriate learning that respects the soul's natural rhythm.

3. Nourishing the Spirit: Consciousness, Meditation, and Higher Knowledge
The spirit (or higher self) connects us to the divine and cosmic wisdom. According to Steiner, we nourish it through inner work, meditation, and spiritual perception.

Meditation & Inner Development

He taught exercises to awaken higher consciousness, such as:

The Rose Cross Meditation (visualizing a glowing rose cross as a symbol of spiritual transformation).

Morning and evening reflections to align daily life with spiritual growth.

Meditation should be active and engaged, not passive.

Study of Spiritual Wisdom

Reading and contemplating esoteric teachings (e.g., the nature of karma, reincarnation, cosmic evolution).

Engaging in moral and selfless acts to refine spiritual perception.

Living with Awareness & Intent

He stressed that every action should be intentional and filled with meaning.

Life should not be lived mechanically; instead, one should develop conscious willpower to align actions with higher truths.

Bringing It All Together: A Holistic Approach
Steiner saw the ideal life as one where the body, soul, and spirit are in harmony. Each of these aspects influences the others:

A healthy body supports a clear and balanced soul.

A nourished soul allows for deeper spiritual perception.

A strong spirit gives purpose and meaning to life.

To live a truly human life, one should eat consciously, cultivate beauty and emotions, and seek spiritual wisdom.

[Firestarter]

Can you elaborate any similarities to the bodies Steiner spoke of and Carlos Castaneda on the double?

ChatGPT said:
Great question! Both Rudolf Steiner and Carlos Castaneda described multiple aspects of human existence, though from different traditions—Steiner from a Western esoteric-Christian framework and Castaneda from Toltec shamanism. There are interesting parallels, especially between Steiner’s "bodies" and Castaneda’s concept of the double (energy body).

1. Steiner’s "Bodies" vs. Castaneda’s "Double"
Steiner described four aspects of the human being, while Castaneda focused on the luminous energy body (or double). Let's compare:

Steiner's Model   Castaneda's Model   Similarities

Physical Body – The material, sensory body   Tonal – The everyday self, bound by physical reality   Both describe the ordinary, perceptible body as limited to the material world.

Etheric Body – A life-energy body that sustains the physical form   Energy Body (Double) – The luminous counterpart, fluid and independent   Both describe a second body of energy,
vital for perception beyond the ordinary.

Astral Body – The seat of emotions, dreams, and higher consciousness   Dreaming Body (Double in Dreaming) – The entity that emerges in lucid dreams   Both describe an "out-of-body" state where awareness can travel beyond the physical.

"I" or Ego – The higher self, connected to spiritual evolution   Nagual – The unknown force guiding the warrior’s path   Both refer to a higher intelligence guiding transformation.
So, Steiner's Etheric and Astral Bodies closely parallel Castaneda's Energy Body/Double—both seen as an extension of human awareness beyond physical reality.

2. The Energy Body and Dreaming

Steiner and Castaneda both describe training to activate this second body:

Steiner’s approach:

He taught that through meditation and moral development, the astral body separates consciously.

Eurythmy, color visualization, and esoteric exercises helped strengthen this connection.

Castaneda’s approach:

The double is developed through dreaming, where a warrior learns to shift awareness into the energy body.

Practitioners master stopping the world (breaking perceptual habits) and seeing energy directly.

Similarity: Both see the second body as a vehicle for higher perception, allowing access to non-ordinary reality.

3. Reincarnation vs. The Seer’s Journey

Steiner taught that through karma and reincarnation, the astral body evolves through lifetimes.

Castaneda rejected reincarnation but described "erasing personal history" to detach from the past.

However, both agree that one’s awareness can survive beyond the physical body, either through reincarnation (Steiner) or total freedom as an energy body (Castaneda’s sorcerers).

Final Thought: Different Paths, Similar Goals

Both Steiner and Castaneda saw human evolution as a shift from material perception to energetic/spiritual awareness.

Steiner’s path: Inner development through moral refinement, meditation, and knowledge.

Castaneda’s path: Stalking and dreaming to break habitual perception and awaken the double.

Both traditions ultimately aim for liberation from ordinary reality—one through spiritual science, the other through sorcery and intent.

Does this comparison make sense to you? Let me know if you’d like me to expand on anything! 😊