Author Topic: Gnostics  (Read 593 times)

Offline Angela

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Gnostics
« on: November 07, 2007, 04:36:05 AM »

I'm reading this book "Gnostic Secrets of the Naassenes" The Initatory Teachings of the Last Supper, by Mark H. Gaffney.  My search for more authentic material led me to this... http://www.sacred-texts.com/jud/tku/index.htm ...is this the Kabbalah in it's entirety?

"If you stop seeing the world in terms of what you like and dislike, and saw things for what they truly are, in themselves, you would have a great deal more peace in your life..."

Offline Angela

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2007, 07:32:05 AM »
Ok...the Kabbalah I'll get into later....

So…I’m reading this book, and I’m about halfway through.  I bought it over a year ago and just recently decided to read it.

Just a little background on Me, and why I’m interested in these writings.

I was raised Roman Catholic, hence I thought it was the “be all, and end all” of religions…that’s what They teach you.  I stopped going to church in high school, because back then, I was sure that God didn’t care if you went to church, or not…just so you “believed”.

I attended holiday masses when I was at family gatherings (Christmas and Easter), and it wasn’t until I decided to get married, that I had to step inside a church again…pre cana (classes you have to take in order to get married in the Catholic church), make the monetary contribution each week, etc.  Did that….then fell away again.  Until the next life changing experience…I got pregnant…then of course, you have to get the child Baptized…again started back to church.   

Fell away again slightly, but then I realized that in order to keep my son out of the public school system (it’s not the best here), and his father’s insistence on raising him Catholic, I had to get more involved with the church/school organizations.  At this point my son was only about three years old, but I was urged by other mothers to get in there early, making sure my son would be accepted into Kindergarten  (I know…it sounds silly).  So I did. 

One of the requirements to keep your child in the Catholic school, is to drop an envelope in the basket every Sunday.  They don’t care how much you give, just so you bring your child to mass every week.  They count the envelopes.

Well, about a year and a half after my divorce, I met Zam…early in our relationship, he showed me a CC book.  I read most all of those, some Theun Mares, Carroll, Gurdjieff, etc., ran into various websites and forums…found Della  :) …of course all of this resonated with me.  I felt like I had opened treasure chest. And now I’m in search of…what I call the “truth”…I know I know what it is, but I need to research the religion I grew up with.  It’s a recapitulation of sorts.

Now, I go to church, because I have to. My thought is, if I Have to go, I may as well make the Best of it. So I see it as a history class…the readings and all.  I people watch, I observe the priests and the manner they “teach”.  One Sunday, Fr. Kevin gave a sermon about an old nun he had met while in the Seminary.  The story was about Death being your Advisor.  Funny how they have similar stories, and then twist them all up.  Anyway, only 9 more years…that’s when my son will graduate from high school. :)

Back to the book…hope I haven’t lost you yet…I know I’m not much of a “creative writer”…so hang on, I’m almost finished. ;)

When I first started reading this book,  I thought it was just another da vince code-esque novel.  But as I read on, Gaffney writes about the histories and beginnings of other religions besides Christianity, and provides documentation of physical evidence and writings, which credit the authenticity of his findings.  It’s very interesting.

In my naivety, I didn’t really understand the beginnings of the Catholic church.  It seems they made most of it up, as the organization grew.  Now I know why They never taught us the history of the church growing up.  Religion and politics…very similar animals, eh?

Anyway, like I said, I’m halfway through…just read some on Judaism and  going into Hinduism.  I like these types of books…the appetizers ;).
"If you stop seeing the world in terms of what you like and dislike, and saw things for what they truly are, in themselves, you would have a great deal more peace in your life..."

nichi

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2007, 08:34:17 AM »
Can't wait to hear more as you journey through the book, Sera!  :-*

Offline Zamurito

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2007, 09:28:55 AM »
Well, about a year and a half after my divorce, I met Zam…early in our relationship, he showed me a CC book.  I read most all of those, some Theun Mares, Carroll, Gurdjieff, etc., ran into various websites and forums…found Della  :) …of course all of this resonated with me.  I felt like I had opened treasure chest. And now I’m in search of…what I call the “truth”…I know I know what it is, but I need to research the religion I grew up with.  It’s a recapitulation of sorts.

Oh, gee, great.

Now it's mine and Della's fault you are the way you are, eh?   ;D

<<<hugs>>>

Love ya' toots,

Zam I Am
"Discipline is, indeed, the supreme joy of feeling reverent awe; of watching, with your mouth open, whatever is behind those secret doors."

Offline Angela

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2007, 02:57:01 PM »
Can't wait to hear more as you journey through the book, Sera!  :-*

It's exciting V, thanks!  :) :-*
"If you stop seeing the world in terms of what you like and dislike, and saw things for what they truly are, in themselves, you would have a great deal more peace in your life..."

Offline Quantum Shaman

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2007, 10:49:13 AM »
Oh, gee, great.

Now it's mine and Della's fault you are the way you are, eh?   ;D

<<<hugs>>>

Love ya' toots,

Zam I Am


Glad to be guilty.   ;)
"You have to be immortal before you will know how to become immortal."
Quantum Shaman  | Quantum Shaman on Facebook

Offline Angela

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2007, 01:07:29 PM »
Oh, gee, great.

Now it's mine and Della's fault you are the way you are, eh?   ;D

<<<hugs>>>

Love ya' toots,

Zam I Am


Glad to be guilty.   ;)

I'm proud to have you both as mentors/teachers/gurus...whatever the hell the politically correct term is...best of all friends!  :-* :-*
"If you stop seeing the world in terms of what you like and dislike, and saw things for what they truly are, in themselves, you would have a great deal more peace in your life..."

Offline Zamurito

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2007, 01:17:06 PM »

I'm proud to have you both as mentors/teachers/gurus...whatever the hell the politically correct term is...best of all friends!  :-* :-*

Young lady, please address us as 'Adepts.'

<<Evil Cackles>>

z

P.S.  Well, address Della as the Adept.  I'm just your whipping boy.  ;)
"Discipline is, indeed, the supreme joy of feeling reverent awe; of watching, with your mouth open, whatever is behind those secret doors."

Offline Quantum Shaman

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2007, 06:09:12 AM »
Young lady, please address us as 'Adepts.'

<<Evil Cackles>>

z

P.S.  Well, address Della as the Adept.  I'm just your whipping boy.  ;)

Most address me by another name.  Starts with a "B".  *LOL*

"You have to be immortal before you will know how to become immortal."
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Offline Michael

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2007, 09:41:00 PM »
Angela, there is a book i want to strongly recommend to you:

'The World’s Religions' - Huston Smith

This book is still a classic text in Studies in Religion courses around the world, and is one of the best ways to be introduced into the overview of humanity's search for 'truth'.

It doesn't deal with the history, it gets to the juicy bones of each religion, including Christianity. But it also chooses the most delicious bones - it is a sheer delight to read, and hold so much knowledge.

This book (like 'A History of Western Philosophy' - Bertrand Russell which does the same for that subject) is truly a must read for anyone who wants to start on the journey of reaching out to our fellow travelers in spirit across the globe.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2007, 09:43:52 PM by Michael »

Offline Angela

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2007, 06:41:50 AM »
Angela, there is a book i want to strongly recommend to you:

'The World’s Religions' - Huston Smith

This book is still a classic text in Studies in Religion courses around the world, and is one of the best ways to be introduced into the overview of humanity's search for 'truth'.

It doesn't deal with the history, it gets to the juicy bones of each religion, including Christianity. But it also chooses the most delicious bones - it is a sheer delight to read, and hold so much knowledge.

This book (like 'A History of Western Philosophy' - Bertrand Russell which does the same for that subject) is truly a must read for anyone who wants to start on the journey of reaching out to our fellow travelers in spirit across the globe.


Thanks Michael.
"If you stop seeing the world in terms of what you like and dislike, and saw things for what they truly are, in themselves, you would have a great deal more peace in your life..."

Offline Angela

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2007, 06:59:02 AM »
    I found very interesting the author's descriptions of how women were excluded from the Church and how scriptures were modified to suit the political atmosphere of the day... some excerpts:

THE WISDOM DIALOGUE INSPIRED BY THE BOOK OF JOB reached its culmination in the teachings of Jesus-yet those same teachings never found their way into orthodox Christianity. The Church aggressively resisted the Divine Mother and succeeded in erasing every trace of her  from its official doctrines.
   In Christianity's earliest days, of course, things were very different. The first Christian churches were loosely organized communities in which a spirit of gender equality often prevailed. We know that women participated in discussions, taught alongside men, and sometimes even led services. Unfortunately, the early policy of openness was the first casualty of institutional Christianity. During the second century, a male hierarchy of deacons, priests, and bishops emerged. Thereafter, men dominated decision making and equality went out the window. By 200 C.E. women had been relegated to subservience. Nor did their low status improve over the many centuries.
   Today, one of the justifications given for this continuing policy is the pseudo-Pauline gospel of I Timothy 2:11-12, which most scholars agree was not the work of Paul: "Let a women learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no women to teach or to have authority over men; she is to keep silent."
   The above line exaggerates Paul's alleged bias against women. In Galatians 3:28 Paul states a more congenial view, one reminiscent of Jesus himself: " . . . in Christ. . . there is neither male nor female." Unfortunately, because Paul's views on women are also more ambiguously stated elsewhere, orthodox bishops seized on the most conservative interpretation. They also argued that because the first apostles were male, the priesthood should be as well. As a result, women were banned from leading services; Mary Magdalene's prominent role was obscured, along with the prophetic mission of the sister and the saintly daughters of the apostle Philip (Acts 21:9; Acts of Philip 108, 109, 115, 126, 142, 148). And let us not forget Mariamne, the inspired teacher mentioned in the Naassene Sermon (Refutation 5.7.1), who, no doubt, was dismissed as a heretic. Also suppressed was the Book of Jasher, with its glowing description of the prophetess Miriam, sister of Moses, who, curiously, also turns up in the Sermon (Refutation 5.8.2).
   Even while the Church was in full retreat regarding the role of women, some Gnostic sects preserved the original policy of gender equality. Although we have no information on this regarding the Naassenes, we know that the Valentinians, another prominent Gnostic community, actively encouraged women to participate in discussions and decision making. Women helped with teaching, baptisms, curing, and even exorcisms, functions that the institutional Church reserved for priests and bishops.
   But the Church's subordination of women was only the most visible sign and symptom of a deeper malady: the obfuscation of the vital role of the Holy Spirit. One of the earliest lists of orthodox scriptures appeared around the time of Irenaeus (180 C.E.). It is known today as the Muratorian Canon, named after Ludovico Antonio Muratori, the Italian archaeologist who discovered the Latin fragment in 1740. Its date is disputed, but most scholars believe the list was from an earlier rather than a later period. Conspicuously absent. from it is any mention of the Gospel of the Hebrews and the Gospel of Thomas, both of which, as we have seen, associate the Spirit with the Divine Mother.
   The Church's official erasure of the Mother had the effect of reducing the Wisdom literature to mere scribblings from the past. The last books of the Old Testament became a quaint collection of gargoyles with no apparent connection with or relevancy to the Gospels. The Church expunged every image of the feminine from its official teachings, the sole exception being the Blessed Mary, mother of Jesus. Given the official misogyny, the question as to why Mary was retained is an interesting one. The probable answer is that there was simply no way to be rid of her. In the year 427 C.E., after the defeat of paganism, Cyril, archbishop of Alexandria, delivered a famous speech in Ephesus, Greece, in which he proclaimed Mary the" Mother of God." Thereafter, statues of Mary were installed in the pagan temples in place of Artemis, Demeter, and Aphrodite. Some of the temples were even converted into Christian basilicas. No surprise that the Virgin Mary immediately acquired a quasi-divine status, a curious compensatory phenomenon that the Church fathers tolerated over the centuries even while frowning upon it.
   Although the Church officially retained the Holy Spirit as an equal member of the Godhead, the Paraclete was either rendered neuter or transformed into a masculine energy imbued with the seminal virility of a pagan fertility god. We are informed in the infancy Gospels of Luke and Matthew-doubtless both late additions-that the Holy Spirit impregnated Mary, the mother of God, accounting for the virginal conception of Jesus-a contrivance that blurred and even obliterated the enormous difference between sexual insemination and the descent of grace. Another effect was to trivialize the Spirit to the point of meaninglessness. No wonder the term Holy Spirit has become a cliche! Yet we need to remember that this stands in sharp contrast with its potency in the first century C.E., when the expression generated incredible excitement.

THE GOSPEL OF HERMAS
   We shall now explore how orthodox Christianity promulgated the removal of the Mother from Church teaching in the day-to-day liturgy. Although the Gospel of Hermas is no longer used and, in fact, is all but, forgotten, it was one of the most important Christian scriptures in the second and possibly third centuries. Today it continues to have a recognized place among the writings of the Apostolic Fathers. The Gospel of Hermas purports to be an inspired revelation. It probably served as a teaching device and may even have been read aloud during services.
   It is of great interest that it begins with a river crossing-an obvious allusion to the events at the Jordan from the Old Testament that we have already discussed: involving Joshua, Elijah, and Elisha. No doubt the reference to the Jordan served to establish the gospel's scriptural pedigree. While dreaming, a young man is shown a number of visions. In these he encounters an old woman who counsels holiness and teaches him many wondrous things and who, we are explicitly informed, is responsible for the visions. In one the young man observes a crew of workmen constructing a great stone tower over a foundation of water - a remarkable image. When the man inquires about it, the old crone explains that he is witnessing the construction of God's Church. Here, the tower is the Church and the workmen, it seems, are angels. The foundation of water is an extremely important mythological concept that we shall explore in more detail in chapter 13. The young man also learns that the crone is a manifestation of the Church-which, notice, means that the Church itself is responsible for the visions.  Although one passage dutifully informs us that the Spirit comes from above, in a key section the Holy Spirit speaks through the Church: The gospel describes the Church in language that is reminiscent of the descriptions of the Divine Mother in Proverbs 8:22-24,27, and 29-31 and in Ecclesiasticus 24:3-30 (see chapter 8 ) : " . . . she [the Church] was created before all things. . . and for her sake the world was formed."
   In this way the Gospel of Hermas was used to prepare Christians for an expansion of Church authority into an area where it had no business going: The goal, it seems, was not simply to expunge the Divine Mother from Christian teaching but in fact to supplant her - that is, to establish the Church in the seat of the Divine Mother herself!  Evidence for this can also be found in the writings of patriarchs like Tertullian and Cyprian, both of whom regarded the Church (rather than the human body) as the temple of the Spirit. In a denunciation of schismatics Cyprian wrote, "He cannot have God for this Father who has not the Church for his Mother."  A similar idea occurs in the following passage from II Clement 14:2 (whose author is unrelated to Clement of Alexandria), an apocryphal but orthodox gospel dating to around 100 C.E.: "For the scripture says 'God created man male and female.' (Gen 1:27) The male is Christ; the female is the Church. Moreover, the books and Apostles declare that the Church not only exists now, but has been in existence from the beginning." Notably, the author here never states precisely which "books and Apostles declare that the Church. . . has been in existence from the beginning" - and not without reason, for there are no such sources in canonical scripture. The line referring to the Church existing "from the beginning" again echoes the references to the Divine Mother in Proverb 8 and Ecclesiasticus 24 (see above and chapter 8 ) . All of this surely accounts for the familiar expression Holy Mother Church.
   The displacement of Sophia by the Church in the Gospel of Hermas is a shocking example of male chauvinism gone amok. There is humorless irony in the fact that the very same Church fathers who, as we have seen, installed an artificial chasm between God and humankind by repudiating immanence also sought to collapse a very real and crucial distinction between a human institution (the Church) and the prerogatives of God (the Divine Mother) - another clear example of the abuse of spiritual authority. In light of the Gospel of Hermas, the subsequent dark chapters in Church history become more understandable. A foundation of water, after all, is spiritual bedrock compared to the shaky footing of a human institution that presumes responsibility for the bestowal of visions, revelations, wisdom, and even divine grace. It could even be argued that in attempting to supplant the role of the Divine Mother, the fathers of the Church came perilously close to the worst kind of blasphemy, for, as we have observed, the bestowal of grace - the Holy Spirit - plainly falls within the purview of the Divine Mother. It most definitely lies outside the jurisdiction of a human institution. The three synoptic accounts are unanimous and unequivocal on this: Every sin is to be forgiven except one - blasphemy against the Spirit (Matthew 12:31, Mark 3:28, and Luke 12:10). Such a judgment, frightening in its implications, may explain why it so often seems that our Christian civilization has gone to the devil.


TAMPERING WITH SCRIPTURE?...
...Today, Mark is indisputably the principal source document for the Gospels of Matthew and Luke, although a second sayings source, now lost and known as "Q," has also been identified.
   It is easy to show that all three of the synoptic accounts of the New Testament are parallel to each other in structure. For example, Peter's Confession (or his Profession of Faith) also occurs in Mark 8. But the line "You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church" is conspicuously absent. Nor can it be found in Luke 9. Because the famous line is absent from the original source document - Mark - the obvious question arises: How did it find its way into Matthew? The Roman Catholic Church has no answer to this question. The evidence we have reviewed strongly suggests that the line in Matthew equating Peter with the foundational rock of the Church was a fabrication, the result of tampering, perhaps, by someone with a political agenda.
    The oldest extant copy of the Gospel of Matthew dates to no earlier than 200 C.E.22 If some lucky archaeological find in the future should produce an older draft - say, a copy of Matthew dating to the last years of the first century - we will probably discover that the line "You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church" is nowhere in evidence. The omission will be as telling as a cloven hoof print in the mud. The main scriptural foundation for the authority of the institutional Church of Rome will have been demolished, once and for all, clearing the way for the rediscovery of the Wisdom teachings of Jesus by many more Christians, leading to a spiritual renaissance in the West. Toward this end, we shall now look more closely at the primary source document for this book, the Naassene Sermon.

"Gnostic Secrets of the Naassenses" by Mark H. Gaffney  pgs. 110-122
"If you stop seeing the world in terms of what you like and dislike, and saw things for what they truly are, in themselves, you would have a great deal more peace in your life..."

nichi

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2007, 07:13:18 AM »
"Father, Son, and Holy Ghost" then took the place of the Triple Goddess ... the virginal Mary (at least the one the Church presented) never quite filled the shoes.

nichi

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Re: Gnostics
« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2007, 07:22:31 AM »
Ang, "The Thunder, Perfect Mind" is interesting... that goddess was power! It was found during the same unearthings as the dead sea scrolls.
(Speculated to be Sophia....)

The Thunder, Perfect Mind
Translated by George W. MacRae
 
I was sent forth from the power,
and I have come to those who reflect upon me,
and I have been found among those who seek after me.
Look upon me, you who reflect upon me,
and you hearers, hear me.
You who are waiting for me, take me to yourselves.
And do not banish me from your sight.
And do not make your voice hate me, nor your hearing.
Do not be ignorant of me anywhere or any time. Be on your guard!
Do not be ignorant of me.
For I am the first and the last.
I am the honored one and the scorned one.
I am the whore and the holy one.
I am the wife and the virgin.
I am <the mother> and the daughter.
I am the members of my mother.
I am the barren one
and many are her sons.
I am she whose wedding is great,
and I have not taken a husband.
I am the midwife and she who does not bear.
I am the solace of my labor pains.
I am the bride and the bridegroom,
and it is my husband who begot me.
I am the mother of my father
and the sister of my husband
and he is my offspring.
I am the slave of him who prepared me.
I am the ruler of my offspring.
But he is the one who begot me before the time on a birthday.
And he is my offspring in (due) time,
and my power is from him.
I am the staff of his power in his youth,
and he is the rod of my old age.
And whatever he wills happens to me.
I am the silence that is incomprehensible
and the idea whose remembrance is frequent.
I am the voice whose sound is manifold
and the word whose appearance is multiple.
I am the utterance of my name.
Why, you who hate me, do you love me,
and hate those who love me?
You who deny me, confess me,
and you who confess me, deny me.
You who tell the truth about me, lie about me,
and you who have lied about me, tell the truth about me.
You who know me, be ignorant of me,
and those who have not known me, let them know me.
For I am knowledge and ignorance.
I am shame and boldness.
I am shameless; I am ashamed.
I am strength and I am fear.
I am war and peace.
Give heed to me.
I am the one who is disgraced and the great one.
Give heed to my poverty and my wealth.
Do not be arrogant to me when I am cast out upon the earth,
and you will find me in those that are to come.
And do not look upon me on the dung-heap
nor go and leave me cast out,
and you will find me in the kingdoms.
And do not look upon me when I am cast out among those who
are disgraced and in the least places,
nor laugh at me.
And do not cast me out among those who are slain in violence.
But I, I am compassionate and I am cruel.
Be on your guard!
Do not hate my obedience
and do not love my self-control.
In my weakness, do not forsake me,
and do not be afraid of my power.
For why do you despise my fear
and curse my pride?
But I am she who exists in all fears
and strength in trembling.
I am she who is weak,
and I am well in a pleasant place.
I am senseless and I am wise.
Why have you hated me in your counsels?
For I shall be silent among those who are silent,
and I shall appear and speak,
Why then have you hated me, you Greeks?
Because I am a barbarian among the barbarians?
For I am the wisdom of the Greeks
and the knowledge of the barbarians.
I am the judgement of the Greeks and of the barbarians.
I am the one whose image is great in Egypt
and the one who has no image among the barbarians.
I am the one who has been hated everywhere
and who has been loved everywhere.
I am the one whom they call Life,
and you have called Death.
I am the one whom they call Law,
and you have called Lawlessness.
I am the one whom you have pursued,
and I am the one whom you have seized.
I am the one whom you have scattered,
and you have gathered me together.
I am the one before whom you have been ashamed,
and you have been shameless to me.
I am she who does not keep festival,
and I am she whose festivals are many.
I, I am godless,
and I am the one whose God is great.
I am the one whom you have reflected upon,
and you have scorned me.
I am unlearned,
and they learn from me.
I am the one that you have despised,
and you reflect upon me.
I am the one whom you have hidden from,
and you appear to me.
But whenever you hide yourselves,
I myself will appear.
For whenever you appear,
I myself will hide from you.

Those who have [...] to it [...] senselessly [...].
Take me [... understanding] from grief.
and take me to yourselves from understanding and grief.
And take me to yourselves from places that are ugly and in ruin,
and rob from those which are good even though in ugliness.
Out of shame, take me to yourselves shamelessly;
and out of shamelessness and shame,
upbraid my members in yourselves.
And come forward to me, you who know me
and you who know my members,
and establish the great ones among the small first creatures.
Come forward to childhood,
and do not despise it because it is small and it is little.
And do not turn away greatnesses in some parts from the smallnesses,
for the smallnesses are known from the greatnesses.
Why do you curse me and honor me?
You have wounded and you have had mercy.
Do not separate me from the first ones whom you have known.
And do not cast anyone out nor turn anyone away
[...] turn you away and [... know] him not.
[...].
What is mine [...].
I know the first ones and those after them know me.
But I am the mind of [...] and the rest of [...].
I am the knowledge of my inquiry,
and the finding of those who seek after me,
and the command of those who ask of me,
and the power of the powers in my knowledge
of the angels, who have been sent at my word,
and of gods in their seasons by my counsel,
and of spirits of every man who exists with me,
and of women who dwell within me.
I am the one who is honored, and who is praised,
and who is despised scornfully.
I am peace,
and war has come because of me.
And I am an alien and a citizen.
I am the substance and the one who has no substance.
Those who are without association with me are ignorant of me,
and those who are in my substance are the ones who know me.
Those who are close to me have been ignorant of me,
and those who are far away from me are the ones who have known me.
On the day when I am close to you, you are far away from me,
and on the day when I am far away from you, I am close to you.
[I am ...] within.
[I am ...] of the natures.
I am [...] of the creation of the spirits.
[...] request of the souls.
I am control and the uncontrollable.
I am the union and the dissolution.
I am the abiding and I am the dissolution.
I am the one below,
and they come up to me.
I am the judgment and the acquittal.
I, I am sinless,
and the root of sin derives from me.
I am lust in (outward) appearance,
and interior self-control exists within me.
I am the hearing which is attainable to everyone
and the speech which cannot be grasped.
I am a mute who does not speak,
and great is my multitude of words.
Hear me in gentleness, and learn of me in roughness.
I am she who cries out,
and I am cast forth upon the face of the earth.
I prepare the bread and my mind within.
I am the knowledge of my name.
I am the one who cries out,
and I listen.
I appear and [...] walk in [...] seal of my [...].
I am [...] the defense [...].
I am the one who is called Truth
and iniquity [...].
You honor me [...] and you whisper against me.
You who are vanquished, judge them (who vanquish you)
before they give judgment against you,
because the judge and partiality exist in you.
If you are condemned by this one, who will acquit you?
Or, if you are acquitted by him, who will be able to detain you?
For what is inside of you is what is outside of you,
and the one who fashions you on the outside
is the one who shaped the inside of you.
And what you see outside of you, you see inside of you;
it is visible and it is your garment.
Hear me, you hearers
and learn of my words, you who know me.
I am the hearing that is attainable to everything;
I am the speech that cannot be grasped.
I am the name of the sound
and the sound of the name.
I am the sign of the letter
and the designation of the division.
And I [...].
(3 lines missing)
[...] light [...].
[...] hearers [...] to you
[...] the great power.
And [...] will not move the name.
[...] to the one who created me.
And I will speak his name.
Look then at his words
and all the writings which have been completed.
Give heed then, you hearers
and you also, the angels and those who have been sent,
and you spirits who have arisen from the dead.
For I am the one who alone exists,
and I have no one who will judge me.
For many are the pleasant forms which exist in numerous sins,
and incontinencies,
and disgraceful passions,
and fleeting pleasures,
which (men) embrace until they become sober
and go up to their resting place.
And they will find me there,
and they will live,
and they will not die again.


Offline Angela

  • Acharya
  • *****
  • Posts: 981
Re: Gnostics
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2007, 07:38:56 AM »
This book is a huge eye opener for me.  I've tried to find a representation of Gaffneys presentation of the Naassene Sermon (Book 5 of "The Refutation of All Heresies"), online, but am unable.  An early bishop of the Church, Bishop Hippolytus, reveals what he sees as "heresy", unknowingly giving us an understanding of the true teachings of Jesus.  There are many references in the Sermon of what I'll call Toltec...only because I seem to be researching backwards...I started with Toltec...heh :).   I'll try to post some examples later.  But, imo, It's a great read, if you have a Christian background/upbringing.
   I skimmed the next chapter and the reading looks like revelations of the "heart", and into chakras, celestial gates, Hinduism, and how these things relate to the teachings of Jesus...
"If you stop seeing the world in terms of what you like and dislike, and saw things for what they truly are, in themselves, you would have a great deal more peace in your life..."

 

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