Restless Soma
Death (the tumbling force, public) => The Cave => Topic started by: Endless~Knot on July 02, 2013, 05:06:45 PM
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The Deceptions of the Ego in Searching for Spirituality
http://www.universalconsciousness.co.uk/The%20Deceptions%20of%20the%20Ego%20when%20searching%20for%20Spirituality.html
So many people who begin their path on their spiritual journey are naive about the many pitfalls that have to be faced, these pitfalls are the learning curve of facing the many fears that the self or ego holds. The ego or outer self hides the truth from who and what we really are, it hides the demons that the self creates and the journey of finding your true spiritual self is to face those demons and accept them. Spiritual awakening can be a beautiful process as it shows us the true meaning of what is within, but it can also be a true awakener of how the outer self or ego has deceived the individual into thinking it was the true self. Spiritual awakening is not a happy go lucky endeavor because the path of truth is deep and profound but it also has a simplicity to it. No spiritual path if walked properly is ever easy because of the obstacles of the many possibilities that the outer self/ego creates to hide the true being of which it overshadows. It does not matter what practices one uses to attain self knowledge and enlightenment or what method is used in meditation, but one must remember the ego will always wait in silence and when it thinks that the inner being is becoming awakened and realises it is losing it's own power then it will step out and ambush the mind with its own self creating ideas of what spiritually is all about thus being for its own gain. One must remember that the outer self/ego always wants to be in charge of the persons thoughts and it will go to any length to deceive these thoughts to being the correct ones.
This is why one must train the mind in accordance with the truth and why it is important to do some form of meditation to calm and clear the mind from the self/ego thoughts, it is only this that can bring understanding of the knowledge and wisdom that the true inner being holds. A confused state of mind is just the ego's disirability of its own creation and this is why it is so cluttered and chaotic it is this that forms layers between the ego's mind of desires and the soul/spirits needs. All these layers must be stripped away before any true enlightenment can be found, and it is cutting away the layers of the ego's desires that can often be painful and hard to master because the self/ego wants to be in charge of its own destination. Spirituality from the inner soul/spirit wants its knowledge to be shared, but when the ego tries to step in and be in charge its only goal is recognition so it can hold onto the status of its own creation. No individual can find the truth of its own inner being without facing up to its own self/ego and its desires.
When the soul/spirit integrates with the self/ego it already knows what its role is and will always attract those that can learn from this knowledge, but it will not go out advertising it or seeking for some kind of re-payment. If the process relied only on the self/ego then the awakened state of mind would become a product which depends only on the cause and effect of its own creation and therefore will eventually dissolve because anything created must at some point die its own death. Enlightenment is permenant and therefore cannot die but stays within the soul/spirit for all infinity, if enlightenment were created in some way through its own desire there would always be the shadow of the ego trying to reassert itself to suit the desires that were being created which would eventually return itself into confusion, which is what the self/ego mind is, but having true enlightenment is permenat because the self/ego has not produced it or created it just discovered it.
The heart of the confusion is that all human beings have this sense that everything is continuous and solid in their world and this comes from the consciousness of the self/ego which projects a self description of who they think they are. When a thought or an emotion or an event occurs there is always a sense of awareness that something is taking place or happening, this is because the individual senses action that is taking place and it is this sense of self that is actually a transitory of a discontinuous event which gives the individual the impression that the mind is solid and continuous. One must remember the brain is a receptor to the self/ego thoughts of emotions which create chaos and illusions to the true reality of what lies behind them and this is how most people take the self's/ego confused view that everything is real. We all struggle to maintain and enhance this solid reality of which the self perceives so strongly, this is because it imposes itself and its will to experience the pain and pleasures in life and it is in this way that we continually struggle to cover up any possibility of discovering the real reality that is within us all.
So ask yourself if you think of your real condition as an awakened state and if so, why are we so busy trying to be aware of avoiding it. It is because we have become so absorbed in this confused state that the self/ego creates and the world and its reality and it is in this sense that we struggle to maintain the semse of a solid continious self that creates the actions that the self ego desires. The self/ego desires to experience both dualities of pain and pleasure as it is through these very sensitive emotions that it can keep control of the reigns. Imagine dark clouds with streaks of light trying to break through, this is the same as our duality of consciousness the higher consciousness of the soul/spirit is the streaks of light trying to shine through the clouds which the self/ego creates.
The Consciousness State of the Human Mind.
The conscious state of the human mind seeks comfort, security and pleasure and shies away from poverty and insecurities because the self/ego's ambition is to secure and entertain itself through the vehicle the human body which it identifies itself. The self/ego does not like too many changes as it loves the comfort of owning various possestions which gives it a status of security. The ego/self likes order and belonging to something whether this is family ties, religious ties, cultures ties anything that bonds it to something else.
It does not like solitude as it's whole existence is to create and experience what it creates. It also acts like a filter to screen the individual away from the true perceptions of what it really is, the ego uses this to project and solidify the reality of the world around us which it likes always to be in control of. The ego is nameable of many things which exist only to the I or the my and mine. The ego also uses the mind in which is controlled via the brain to the awareness of self that all humans have within their conscious form. But it is not through the mind of the self/ego that one finds the true inner self this can only be obtained through stilling the chaos of the ego and mind and allow the silence of the inner mind to come through bringing quietness, peace and contentment. Some people have a bigger ego/self indentity than others and those who do, always have more layers between the soul/spirit and the self/ego which always takes longer to strip them away.
The power of the soul/spirit is strong when it awakens to its true role, but the strength of the ego/self is much stronger as it sees itself as the core of its own being. The structures and habits that the ego creates are strong and it takes a lot of self disicpline to cut away the barriers, these structures creates fundlemental myths that are believed because the ego gives us the belief that everything is solid and we are only solid beings, when in fact we are spiritual beings in a physical form once the spirit is awakened. The only way to free ourselves from the burden of this sense of solidity is to free ourself from the ego's deception and habits and to slowly cut away the layers that bind us. So bit by bit one must sever the ties until one gets to the true source of the spiritual being the true role in which is the reason why we are here.
When searching for your own spiritual being one must learn some form of meditation as it is the only way to still the mind to allow the light of the inner mind to project itself through, it is only when the gaps of light appear in the clouds that insights are glimsed to help shine the way towards finding the inner being. Meditation is not controlling the mind it is stilling the neurotic state of the neurons that create confusion within the mind that the ego/self creates, now to alter that pattern or structure is to bring the mind still, so you can open a door into the mind of the soul/spirit. In this way one can learn and deal with so many factors that come into our daily lives and relate to them with a much more open mind than the clustered one of the ego. Think of it like a stringed instrument the strings can neither to be too taut or too loose, it is the same with meditation one should not impose anything forcefully on the mind, neither should it be left to wander in too many directions so that it allows the self to take back control. In true meditation there is no ambition or desires of material worth there is just an acceptance of letting it be. The ego/self's delusions create vivid wonderful emotions or fear which captures the minds attention, its a bit like watching a good film we get engrossed in what we are watching and the ego is the one that is engrossed to what it is creating. Meditation neither encourages these images but it also it does not suppress them because when you see with clarity and clearness you allow them to be as they are and not as some form of entertainment or a form of distracting the mind, thus it becomes an inexhaustable flow of energy which fulfills egoless action.
So by examining our own thoughts, emotions and fears our concepts can glimpse the reality of the illusions of which the ego/self mind builds arounds us. From this pointon we can eleviate the struggle and prove the existence of the soul/spirit so there is no need to have rules and be dominated by the habits that the ego creates. It is only in the egoless state of which our soul/spirit resides in that enlightenment can be attained, this is because the soul/spirit becomes aware of its true role. We cannot always be aware of the true source that the ego/self imitates because it is so good at what it does, this makes the individual believe that some of its choices are in the spiritual mode and not in what is termed as the self mode. The ego/self can translate everything in term of its desires because when it experiences these desires it feels a great sense of power and achievement. It has the ability to create its own pattern one that is not always in alignment to the original pattern of the soul/spirit energies. When one can express themselves through the spiritual consciousness of the spirit, it then has a direct route to the spirits conscious path, but when it is re-routed by the imitation of the self/ego's attempt to use spirituality for its own gain, then the genuine spiritual development which is at a much deeper level is very unlikely to occur. This is due to the mental habits being stronger which creates a barrier which the soul/spirit cannot penatrate. The mind of the ego is far more powerful in subverting the spirit from rising above it.
The Structure of the Ego/Self
Most of us if we are honest are subjected and ruled by the ego's structure in the five sense world, we often without knowing it defend the ego/self making excuses for the actions we make, we make all kind of excuses for being a human being but it is only because we have not fully understood that we are all spiritual beings in human form if we only allowed it to be. Nothing can shield us from the world of war, poverty, crime, disease, growing old and all the securities that we think we need, these fears and emotions can only be altered when the state of the inner consciousness rises to the surface and over comes the habitual habits of fear. All the fears we experience are from the outside reality which conditions our lives and it is very hard and needs a lot of discipline to eradicate them. One must remember that the ego gives us all a false structure to what life is all about and how that everything around us is solid including the aspect of how we percieve ourselves to be. But this is a myth that we want to believe in because it gives us a structure which protects us to some form of comfort, but in the deeper realms of the true reality it is the root of all our suffering. The only way to free ourselves and give us all liberation is to begin by changing our habits our perceptions, our ideals and outside influences, we must slowly cut away the layers bit by bit until we get to the true source of our inner being and to understand why we are here and allow the vehicle to play the role of the spirit to guide us on the path created for us. No spiritual path is easy as there are to many layers to cut through and this takes time and patience to be able to still the mind and have a much clearer view of where you are going and rid yourself of the confusion and chaos that the ego's mind creates and instills in us. So trust that the inner being as it is the only one that knows where it is going and what it needs to experience.
The structure of the ego's consciousness is created out of a materialistic views of the mind via the brain, our thoughts and emotions the outer self creates only filters itself through the brain into what we call reality and the only way to calm the chaotic mind is to get outside the confusion of the mind and to still it with methods of meditation as it is only through this techinique that one can aquire insight. One does not need to give up the work or the ambitions of the work that you are doing as whatever skill you have comes from the tools of the inner being it is all part of the role you are playing, as long as you keep a balance knowing whatever it is you are doing you are doing with the highest intent which will help benifit others in some way as well as yourself. As long as you dont have the intent of I am, me or mine only doing it from the egotistcal perception of the I in big capital letters then all will be shown to you as the guidance will be given to which path is waiting for you.
The Transcendance of the Ego to the Spirit
Any transcendendence of energies from the subtle body to the physical is to accept your fears and accept the mirror image that the ego is trying to protect and have the ability to see things of how they really are and not how the self perceives them to be. So many spiritual teachings focus on spreading the word love but love is an emotion which has duality to its meaning, what is really needed is to send out compassion and accept the events that occur knowing there is a much bigger picture than any of us can see and trust in the inner guidance which is there so you can tap into its energies and be guided on your rightful path . Look for balance in all things, the universal energies create duality such as light and dark but without darkness we would not have light and when you accept the duality then you can begin to balance the whole. There are many who teach with flowery aspects of words to give the spirituality of their teaching some mystic divine essence to it, but there is no mystic realms in universal creation only the truth of its creation which interprets the duality of consciousness and when one find the balance between these two then you have found the wholeness and the essence of the soul/spirit consciousness which is spiritual awareness and true enlightenment.
The creator of all creation does not play dice in anything you see in the world past, present or future, the only changes that occur are the ones derived from the human consciousness of free will. Universal creation is a structure where every thing grows and evolves continiously in its ever expanding growth of its own spirituality. Nothing happens by chance and if you walk the path chosen for you many inspirations and experiences will manifest themselves to you, but if you chose your own path through the fear and desires of the self then you must expect to experience whatever it is you have created. There are many pitfalls in the many desires of your outer being and the only way to rid yourself of them is to let go of the many illusions that the outer self or ego creates. So let go and surrender to what you really are and try to find the true guidance of why you are really here and to what purpose your role is that you have come to play. Remember your role and the play that you are in and the true realisation of your path will be shown to you. We all have our roles and we are all here for a purpose no matter what that purpose may be, we are all important to the role given to the soul/spirit so it may experience the role of its own creation. Without a body of matter the spirit could not experience what the creator creates this is from everything from a fly to an ant and from a bird to a human all atoms of matter have their individual role to play in the great universal play of creation.
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The poor ego gets a bad rap. And when you think about it, it probably deserves it. It is not real in the sense of being like, our true self, but it is relatively real in that we created 'something' of sorts and then later in life, learn about the ego and realize we have a lot of work to do.
I wrote years ago a post on cornering ego on a spiritual path, which started a hefty thread in here. Basically, ego wants to survive and move on, and even go on into the afterlife and live forever. So when it seeks a spiritual path to do this, later, somewhere along the path, it learns, the ego must either a) be eliminated or b) shrunk considerably.
I'll give an example of ego as I am a dreamer. Many dreams Ive had, I would be in the passenger seat of a car and it is driving along quite fine. I realize, hey no one is driving, but I need to, and I grab the wheel. Then the car gets erratic. Then it almost wrecks. I work to try to get in the drivers seat, but I cannot.
When Spirit and true self is in the drivers' seat, then all is smooth. But when ego is in the drivers seat, it is a wreck waiting to happen. This is how it works on the spiritual path. Ego has to get to the passengers side and not be in charge of the journey anymore.
This is very difficult because it is so ingrained in us, who we are. We think we know. But when we end up on the path, begin reading, begin meditating, begin doing whatever we do, we find out we dont really know ourselves as much as we thought.
We have to be willing to 'let go' to the higher self and Spirit, to undo the reign ego has had on our lives. Learn to let go and this takes trust. Yes it is hard to do, but it is necessary or else we will not progress.
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We have to learn the art of 'surrender.'
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You have included some truths in some not so simple contexts. I can't even begin to clarify what I mean. Just need to say, it's not so easy.
To give something to consider: DJ spoke of the usefulness of the warrior's path, but he also spoke of the relief when achieving a level of knowledge where one could use seeing instead of the warrior's path. This is all about the evolution of the ego. As a general (by no means a rule) path of development used as the 'recommended' sequence:
1. We are passive and lazy. We suck up the attitudes and behaviours of those around us, being our family and broader culture. We think we have will, but in fact we are powerless to chart our own course through life, except in small matters. If we accidentally land on a reasonable ground-bed, our seed grows into an ego which will keep us sane and healthy until death - not a bad outcome for the vast majority.
2. We begin to awaken, and thus we begin to seek to participate in our life journey: we naturally yearn to move from passive to active.
3. Our increased autonomy causes problems and resistance in the world, because we are attempting to break the command of a passive life, to shift across to the command of an active life.
4. We are forced to adopt the code of the warrior, and to the extent we learn to do this well, we can succeed. But the warrior's code is a lonely road, and although full to the brim of enjoyment and interest, it remains inherently an identity of separation. Yet there is a truth in this separation which has been deemed of immense value to anyone on the path of development - we need to come to terms with spiritual loneliness, and learn what the most famous Tibetan teacher said: "Alone is alright".
5. We gradually learn the art of working with Spirit, in that our own efforts alone are insufficient. We become a partner on the road.
6. We have the realisation of what I call, being embedded in all. I don't like to talk much about this, as it has been used to validate the first position as fine, with no need to change. Basically it is a point when the work of the sword has been done, and our individuation is cohesive - we can hang up our sword, knowing if ever necessary we can pick it up again (like Shane), but that we have a new way to navigate the world. We are still called upon to struggle, but we intrinsically see ourselves as 'within', instead of outside or against. This stage can't be fudged, which has been a huge error of the New Age spirituality.
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Yes I have people in my life but I understand still there is a loneliness to the warrior path. It is one I do not talk about to others much or explain. Because they would probably think I'm mad being on the path I am on. However, I must walk the path laid before me which calls my name. I can choose no other. Other peoples paths may lead to doom and I just cannot take a chance of walking their paths.
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Our attitudes to the ego have undergone some not-too-useful changes in the last fifty or sixty years. I use the word ego in its popular sense.
Without realising it, we have been affected by fashions and themes of attitude through the decades. It has become a common view these days that the ego must be eliminated for spiritual purposes, but also in other areas more public. We associate the ego with the whole concept of judging, and that concept has undergone changes in the last half century.
In the spiritual sphere, we had all the Eastern religious thought coming in from the 60s, although generally we now see its inception with Blavatsky and Olcott in the Theosophical Society. There is a strong theme in Eastern philosophy that true realisation can't be gained unless we remove the ego. This has been vastly over stated. Of course this idea is essential, but it is not the only thing in Eastern thought. The entire concept of Vishnu wouldn't exist if that were so.
Thus we have been taught to suspend judgement, without the other side of developing judgement, which has always been in Eastern thought - consider the Buddha's emphasis on discernment. This emphasis on non-judgement led to a moral cowardice on the part of those in the spiritual sphere.
There is a disputed difference between the Christian idea of self-abasement before God, and the Hindu/Buddhist idea of inner nothingness. I don't feel they are the same - the European/Middle Eastern thought is revolted by the idea of eliminating the core self, whereas Buddhism especially, as well as Advaita Hinduism, hold to the view that ultimately there is nothing there, in our core and in the core of the world. This has definitely led to the idea of removing the ego, but it fails to understand the long process wherein the ego has to be carefully trained and strengthened in order to be put aside temporarily, not removed altogether which would mean death.
In the public sphere, the Left which evolved out of the 50s and 60s felt a powerful reaction against all those social and institutional forces which had been repressing people with their moral codes. There was a tremendous sense of emancipation and the release of free thought. Out of this, the Left developed a resistance to being judged, but they also activated against judgement itself, by ourselves or anyone as they feared its coercive side. Again this led to vacating the moral public stage, which became filled by monetary values.
The Right suspended judgement on the old lines of public good - the values of national institutions and traditions - and allowed the business world to become the new morality. So in a sense, even in the public sphere, the ego became captive of whoever had the money to define it back to us. I noticed in Australia this began in the 80s very strongly. People sucked up any and all superficial values and judgements which were propagated by wealthy interests and consumerism.
All this has resulted in a vacuum of development of the inner self in learning to build an ego based on deep values and worthwhile purposes of living. There are still the old forces of moral crusaders, and now the new forces of grab-what-you-can venality. No where do we find the forces of courage in digging to the depths of our being, bringing back values, and standing forth with those values in our judgements. Our inner soul has been intimidated into holding its tail beneath its back legs.
The ego can only step aside when it has built transparency and strength. And this is also why I am not shy of speaking out at crap when I see it.
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Yeah I think my dream was telling me to not concern with eliminating the ego, but to go to the side and allow Spirit and Higher Self to be in charge, so that pretty much is going to be my approach.
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Can the ego in a good form be 'knowing yourself'?
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Philosophically, I don't mean in particular the attributes of your self / the self.
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Can the ego in a good form be 'knowing yourself'?
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Philosophically, I don't mean in particular the attributes of your self / the self.
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Well the ego has difficulty in understanding what the Self (upper case) is. This is very difficult. Because the Self is very unfathomable.
I will try to give my perspective. I am little me, and I understand there is a higher being connected to me, yet that is not me, but wholly connected. And I am learning what that Self is. I am unsure of the total nature of it. because I am here, in the total, trying to grasp the spiritual side of life. However, all is not at a loss; I can understand by digging deep, and meditating, and really exploring the spiritual the best I can, so I can gain knowledge, not just about the spiritual, but about my Self. I can know myself, but I am still clouded by egos needs and egos wants. So like the dream I expressed, I have to really work hard at taking the passengers seat, and let Self drive if I expect to get anywhere. AND then I can harmonise my little self with my true Self and then with this harmony, I can learn to understand myself.
Like you speak of balance, and learning to do this, it is about balance. Balance balance balance.
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If may add to this a bit. The ego is what maintains the identity of the self. Given the full emotional range the "feeling body" presents to the ego to deal with, the neutral observer must arise from under the cloud of separation in anyone engaging a spiritual path. Once that is achieved there is a working understanding that the ego, is part of a structure, designed to create a singularity. That singularity if it has energy can withstand the pressure of the nagual in Toltec terms, and in new age they would say maintain a higher frequency vibrational field for longer and longer periods of time. The ego if it is not understood by the observer, will lack detachment, getting hooked by any transgressions that the emanations at large my bring up to be dealt with, creating an emotional support for the ego to justify things like feeling depression or insecure.
The Deceptive part of the ego is then when it singles something out to focus on and then the emotional support kicks in to be and act out of integrity.
This ego though is not the observer, it is the current of energy that shields the parameters of a singularity. As a beings intensity/energy rises the deceptions fall away, the observer sees when the ego is moving itself into energetic currents that lack integrity and then this can be used to feel justified in feeling for example a victim, or maintaining power over others for security, and of course everyones favorite self importance.
One of the best experiences for me was that I had moments of rage/anger when I felt my integral boundaries were being transgressed. As I worked on this, the first phase I tried to just never get angry, when I still got angry , then I started to get angry at myself for getting angry lol. Now I see getting angry as something I just see as a current of energy, much like your senses picking up something to hot to touch. I still get angry but my emotions don't kick in and support rage. Anger in that light is just a warning, is recognizable and is just part of the emotional field of experience.
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Nemo, I think you give ego a bad name.
But this is just a speculation.
For me the Ego is a natural part of us, speaking though not with 'thought' , just very "Simply".
Just wanted to post,
in the name of balance that we talked about as well.
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The ego is what maintains the identity of the self. Given the full emotional range the "feeling body" presents to the ego to deal with, the neutral observer must arise from under the cloud of separation in anyone engaging a spiritual path. Once that is achieved there is a working understanding that the ego, is part of a structure, designed to create a singularity. That singularity if it has energy can withstand the pressure of the nagual in Toltec terms, and in new age they would say maintain a higher frequency vibrational field for longer and longer periods of time. The ego if it is not understood by the observer, will lack detachment, getting hooked by any transgressions that the emanations at large my bring up to be dealt with, creating an emotional support for the ego to justify things like feeling depression or insecure.
You haven't made that easy to read nemo. I had to come back another day to get it.
The important aspect is that the ego is not so much tamed by repression, but by the arrival of a deeper part of ourselves. This has been one of the problems with all the instruments we use to tame the ego: work place, relationships, family, school. All these condition our ego to behave, but alas, none of them provide much assistance in bringing forth 'the observer'. Nothing wrong with knocking a truculent ego on the head, but unless there exists some manifestation of the observer, the ego is likely to build subconscious resentment, or timidity, instead of preparing it for cooperation in the task of 'singularity'.
The world we live in now, has moved further away from recognition of our primary task as living beings, and as such we are confronted by a mass of resentful egos.
"the supreme calling of every human being is to aspire to self realization. All other obligations are secondary" [Anandamayi Ma]
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I think it will take a bit before I can really understand what everyone is talking about, I get a small sense of it but the only thing I could come up with is this.
I cannot tell weather my ego has been fully tamed or weather it is in full force and needs work.
I sit in a pretty peaceful state most of the time, quite thoughtless actually, I don't get enveloped by emotions any more. Unless I watch a film about heroism or see the rain or witness something beautiful.
I always love hearing about pitfalls on a path though, what things to watch out for. Maybe I just don't have a sense of ego but I cant seem to bounce these descriptions off of anything.
The ego is what maintains the identity of the self. Given the full emotional range the "feeling body" presents to the ego to deal with, the neutral observer must arise from under the cloud of separation in anyone engaging a spiritual path. Once that is achieved there is a working understanding that the ego, is part of a structure, designed to create a singularity. That singularity if it has energy can withstand the pressure of the nagual in Toltec terms, and in new age they would say maintain a higher frequency vibrational field for longer and longer periods of time. The ego if it is not understood by the observer, will lack detachment, getting hooked by any transgressions that the emanations at large my bring up to be dealt with, creating an emotional support for the ego to justify things like feeling depression or insecure.
In reading this I think maybe I have a sliver of ego left, maintaining just enough self to be able to communicate with people. I get the sense that you are mostly talking about detachment and Oneness or burning from the fire from within (the singularity). Which is what you need to do in order to deal with the teachings of the toltec path. But I am trying to understand what you mean by this line specifically, I really like it but I cant understand it. The ego if it is not understood by the observer, will lack detachment
So if you don't understand the ego, you will lack detachment? I guess my question would be then maybe not about the ego but weather or not I have detachment.
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Nemo, I think you give ego a bad name.
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Nikos, This is my seeing of the ego. The universe/creation/god/prime/source/allthatis does things, is things events etc. One thing in an expanse of things it is doing, is trying to create singularities that have higher abilities individually, without them being corrupt or corrupted. The ego is a great tool, and is not the self, look at more as a programmable thing that personal power can update as it gains energy in one form or another, information just being one form of updating.
The ego if it is not understood by the observer, will lack detachment
Hi CherryArc, Look at the the ego as the car, and the observer as the you outside of the car. Then at some point energetically speaking the car needs you to get in it and direct it. Detachment means you are able to get out of the car and back in it as you please.
Another way to say this is, someone with autism does not have the full emotional body/ego matrix we consider normal, but they still have an observer "see"?
Yes Michael, sorry I have been attempting to catch up on some of my posting and not giving it the time i need to be cogent. Though you did get it, by the looks of it.
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Nikos, This is my seeing of the ego. The universe/creation/god/prime/source/allthatis does things, is things events etc. One thing in an expanse of things it is doing, is trying to create singularities that have higher abilities individually, without them being corrupt or corrupted. The ego is a great tool, and is not the self, look at more as a programmable thing that personal power can update as it gains energy in one form or another, information just being one form of updating.
Hi CherryArc, Look at the the ego as the car, and the observer as the you outside of the car. Then at some point energetically speaking the car needs you to get in it and direct it. Detachment means you are able to get out of the car and back in it as you please.
Another way to say this is, someone with autism does not have the full emotional body/ego matrix we consider normal, but they still have an observer "see"?
Yes Michael, sorry I have been attempting to catch up on some of my posting and not giving it the time i need to be cogent. Though you did get it, by the looks of it.
No nemo!!! LOL :) Per my dream ego does not drive, ego takes a passenger seat, and however you want to say it, double/higherself/unfathomable self/no self as self/buddha nature/christ consciousness drives. Ego wants to drive but it can spell disaster if it does. One of the acts in dealing with ego is to surrender, and step aside on the spiritual path. :)
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re-read what i said knot, u will see we are in agreement.
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I cannot tell weather my ego has been fully tamed or weather it is in full force and needs work.
Hello CherryArc, and welcome to Restless Soma.
What you say here is absolutely true - what is the ego? How do I know if I have a rabid ego or just a nicely-fitting one? When we look inside, which part of what we perceive is the 'ego'.
Firstly, we are not really speaking of the ego as defined by the likes of Jung and Freud. It is too difficult to get into that. The word has taken on a popular meaning derived from the word egotism: the quality of being excessively conceited or absorbed in oneself. As a rule of thumb, it has to do with constantly thinking about how we present to others and how others behave towards us. If you constantly think about what other people think about you (called 'looking in the rear-vision mirror') then you have an ego problem from a spiritual perspective (not from a common social world perspective).
Nemo gave a good example, but actually, it can be very difficult to know, because the ego has a clever way of disguising itself. While we live in familiar surroundings, the ego sits in power because it has spent years arranging everything and everyone to suit its requirements. It's not until we venture into unfamiliar surroundings, that the ego becomes exposed. Its tell-tale indicators are our host of likes and dislikes, all the little things which upset us. It is seen in how we respond to annoyances, our attitudes to how others should behave, and whether we are susceptible to disgust - basically, how we deal with unpleasantness.
The next best level of ego estimation, is our ability to stand outside ourselves - to have the emotional freedom to watch ourselves from outside, rather than be continually trapped in the cockpit of our focus. In fact, we don't really 'stand' outside, so much as transfer our perception from one point to another, but that is a bit more complicated to explain.
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re-read what i said knot, u will see we are in agreement.
Ok I reread, Sorry I interpreted a bit differently but see it now.
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Hello CherryArc, and welcome to Restless Soma.
What you say here is absolutely true - what is the ego? How do I know if I have a rabid ego or just a nicely-fitting one? When we look inside, which part of what we perceive is the 'ego'.
Firstly, we are not really speaking of the ego as defined by the likes of Jung and Freud. It is too difficult to get into that. The word has taken on a popular meaning derived from the word egotism: the quality of being excessively conceited or absorbed in oneself. As a rule of thumb, it has to do with constantly thinking about how we present to others and how others behave towards us. If you constantly think about what other people think about you (called 'looking in the rear-vision mirror') then you have an ego problem from a spiritual perspective (not from a common social world perspective).
Nemo gave a good example, but actually, it can be very difficult to know, because the ego has a clever way of disguising itself. While we live in familiar surroundings, the ego sits in power because it has spent years arranging everything and everyone to suit its requirements. It's not until we venture into unfamiliar surroundings, that the ego becomes exposed. Its tell-tale indicators are our host of likes and dislikes, all the little things which upset us. It is seen in how we respond to annoyances, our attitudes to how others should behave, and whether we are susceptible to disgust - basically, how we deal with unpleasantness.
The next best level of ego estimation, is our ability to stand outside ourselves - to have the emotional freedom to watch ourselves from outside, rather than be continually trapped in the cockpit of our focus. In fact, we don't really 'stand' outside, so much as transfer our perception from one point to another, but that is a bit more complicated to explain.
This brings me a lot of clarity. I remember a point once where I was very concerned about these type of things. But although most things do not bug me any more, I operate almost as if from a set of morals sometimes, I do not know where dealing with petty tyrants fits in, but sometimes I will not be angry about something, but I will deliver justice as it were, just because it should be done. I also find I look back on situations and Social occurrences stand out as not, how to describe it, the best decision made or I did not act impeccably. So I find I look back on those occurrences to assess them under the guise of impeccability. Because I want to learn from those instances. I feel like I want to hit all the green lights, instead of hitting a few reds as it were.
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I feel like I want to hit all the green lights, instead of hitting a few reds as it were.
I like that. I think I get what you mean.
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I had another insight to explain this.
The ego is very emotion and mind based, calculating and prone to manipulation both ways, and is insecure. (first attention intent based)
The observer is heart based, and is the medium for acts of power, and assuredness.
A balanced being bridges these, and the first attention intent fades in importance.
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I had another insight to explain this.
The ego is very emotion and mind based, calculating and prone to manipulation both ways, and is insecure. (first attention intent based)
The observer is heart based, and is the medium for acts of power, and assuredness.
A balanced being bridges these, and the first attention intent fades in importance.
Yes! I definitely feel at the mercy of emotions with the go. But with the double I feel the heart, which feels more different. Like a whole different ball game.
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I do not know where dealing with petty tyrants fits in
Yes it does fit in, but actively taking on a petty tyrant is an advanced technique - more for the adventurous among us. Still requires considerable ground work first. Nonetheless, petty tyrants can be employed just for practising patience and tolerance, as they abound in our normal life, and this is excellent for knocking the sharp edges of our ego. One of the hardest tasks is handling the attacks on us from others. Knowing how to not get offended, and yet knowing how to take offence actively - inner freedom from the emotional whammies, and effective response. This is something we learn though effort and experience over many years, but it absolutely relies upon our ability to regard ourselves in the third person.
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Great timing on this topic , i have been rattled for a few days by an incident . I am not sure if correct , yet i will say , in the establishing of a peaceful space or balance , sometimes it feels something or somebody will make a bid for us "it" or our peace .
The most beautiful times can be interrupted by intense disturbances , which have contrasted and abruptly shake that peace.
Being caught off gaurd .
A response i notice was one of a closed stance " digging heels in " when confronted with an seeming absurd emotional accostament.
This leads to a situation of tension which makes for " make or break" usually on my emotions and bodily state .
and leaves no room for movement having esablished the seeming stage for which the following act to play out .
Damn triggers too quick .
We can be caught in seeing , obseredly elsewise , or acting off balance . And the balance being struck to ignite action from a more panoramic avanue .
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A response i notice was one of a closed stance " digging heels in " when confronted with an seeming absurd emotional accostament.
This leads to a situation of tension which makes for " make or break" usually on my emotions and bodily state .
and leaves no room for movement having esablished the seeming stage for which the following act to play out .
Damn triggers too quick .
I know exactly what you mean - it happens to me, and I feel it rising up inside me. It is a real skill to pull out into the observation position, and ask, "What on earth are you doing?" Except that seems so limp, when being thrust forward in the heat of the moment into a really outrageous reaction delivers a delicious sense of satisfaction, usually regretted for a long time afterwards.
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'The idea that people who don't know enough also don't know enough to realise that they don't know enough ("Dunning-Kruger effect" is so much simpler to get your tongue around) isn't particularly new.
Bertrand Russell in The Triumph of Stupidity in the mid 1930s said that "The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt."
Even earlier, Charles Darwin, in The Descent of Man in 1871, stated "ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge."
The Dunning-Kruger effect occurs when incompetent people not only perform a task poorly or incompetently, but lack the competence to realize their own incompetence at a task and thus consider themselves much more competent than everyone else. Put more crudely, they're too stupid to realize they're stupid.'
This is the very case of our egos.
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I really need to say , lol .
Thanks that made me laugh
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Off topic I know
here though is the Oracle report for today
(I thought it 'll add beauty)
Monday, July 29, 2013
Third Quarter Moon Phase - Moon in Taurus - Ruling Mahavidya: Shodashi
It has been an interesting and unprecedented month with Kali and four other Mahavidyas sharing the reigns at various times. Today, Shodashi takes center stage, working toward bringing what is in our highest and best desire. Her energy is the most playful of all of the Mahavidyas; she is ever-youthful; and she stirs us to see and create beauty. Shodashi's span is vast and she is able to work at such far-reaching levels due to the assistance of Matangi - The Administrator. Shodashi and Matangi always work together.
Shodashi's energy is blissful. We go into a "special land" when Shodashi is on duty. While she is at work putting circumstances in place to fulfill our highest desire she is simultaneoulsy pounding away at the demiurge, the head archon, leader of the pack to enslave the free will and creativity of humanity.
Today we are invited to bask in the light of Shodashi by finding/creating beauty, looking at a bigger or longer-term picture, and participating in the pummeling of dark forces by drumming (if you don't have a drum, you can hit beats on your leg or on a makeshift drum - anything can be a drum).
To facilitate the connection with Shodashi, free yourself from worries by turning them over to the Wisdom Goddesses. This gives room for Shodashi to enter and settle fun, love of life, and deep appreciation of self as a starry being. Shodashi sees past deficiency and calls forth divine talents and unique potential inherent in everyone. She sees and brings out the good in people. Welcome to her day!
(Note: Here's an interesting article entitled "Mysterious NASA Video of Saturn Reveals Impossible Hexagon-Shaped Cloud Pattern Larger Than Planet Earth" published yesterday at NaturalNews.com. The cloud pattern is a result of the type of energy being disseminated by the planet. The Mahavidyas have been hard at work lately to transform the electro-magnetic-harmonic [astrological] frequency of Saturn. Instead of it being the originator of energy to enslave, dominate, and control, it is being reprogrammed to structure open systems based on freedom, upliftment, and release. Saturn is not what it used to be and ideas about it will have to change accordingly.)
-~
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Bertrand Russel said through Michael:
Bertrand Russell in The Triumph of Stupidity in the mid 1930s said that "The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt."
Just want to point out to my seeing Bertrand is off the mark here. As this world is one of full spectrum's. Within the Intelligent and stupid communities, we will find equal amounts of cocksure intelligent people and doubtful stupid people. He must have not been a "seer" :)
The fundamental cause of trouble in the modern world is that peoples energy is harvested by sorcerers of the second attention. Of course they will use their minions to misdirect and subjugate both stupid and intelligent equally.
His statement to me is a fundamental example of the deception of the ego. The ego will read that and say, "Yes this world is screwy because of the stupid people :) As a matter of fact Bertrand was cocksure of himself was he not? lol
Just being a little ornery because I am not a big fan of Russels.
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Bertrand Russel said through Michael:
Bertrand Russell in The Triumph of Stupidity in the mid 1930s said that "The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt."
Just want to point out to my seeing Bertrand is off the mark here. As this world is one of full spectrum's. Within the Intelligent and stupid communities, we will find equal amounts of cocksure intelligent people and doubtful stupid people. He must have not been a "seer" :)
The fundamental cause of trouble in the modern world is that peoples energy is harvested by sorcerers of the second attention. Of course they will use their minions to misdirect and subjugate both stupid and intelligent equally.
His statement to me is a fundamental example of the deception of the ego. The ego will read that and say, "Yes this world is screwy because of the stupid people :) As a matter of fact Bertrand was cocksure of himself was he not? lol
Just being a little ornery because I am not a big fan of Russels.
Yeah my boyfriend and I were talking about good versus bad people and what constitutes and such. And he has a pretty dismal look at the bad people in the world. Granted, they may be running the show half the time like in politics, but they don't control the world. I would hope. I think he is very sensitive to the foreign installation and at the mercy of it whereas I am not as bad. I am at least aware of it.
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I had another insight to explain this.
The ego is very emotion and mind based, calculating and prone to manipulation both ways, and is insecure. (first attention intent based)
The observer is heart based, and is the medium for acts of power, and assuredness.
A balanced being bridges these, and the first attention intent fades in importance.
Beautiful poetic description, sir.
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Yes I agree and very importanly said the first attention fades in importance. It certainly has for me. Well said nemo.
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Sir - I don't think I qualify Skyfower :-[ blush
Yes the first attention and the intent that comes with it was the most significant effect, which was also the biggest affect.
Thx for the positive feedback
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Sir - I don't think I qualify
Sir - I think you qualify. :D
Pardon me.
We all look at the world through our glasses. ..... I think.
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In the spirit of equality , i have laughed equally at myself and others , within michaels quotes. :)
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Now
With the bridging of lands
land swept abyssmal
From vantage point none
Although prone to the belief
Swept through once again
this light fell upon
It got in the eyes
So it perceived its perceived itself
And it makes me apply it to the setting
Yet become aware
Yet not still
Stationary i try to pin it with my voice
Yet shreik for its use
And i can not conceive
Why
So i try and try and try
Oh where
Was
I
May it rain again and again
i like the name cherry arc
the image
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May it rain again and again
i like the name cherry arc
the image
Well I suggested this forum to Cherryarc! I think he's a good fit!
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Yes reminds me of the arc - ing , of cherries . And cherries grow on trees and birds eat cherries , and arc - ing cherries to birds
Within trees must be a sweet
Thing to taste :)
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Yes reminds me of the arc - ing , of cherries . And cherries grow on trees and birds eat cherries , and arc - ing cherries to birds
Within trees must be a sweet
Thing to taste :)
Very nice perception. I am unsure what the choice is for the name. Would be nice if he would enlighten us. But if he prefers mystery I can accept that too.
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Great timing on this topic , i have been rattled for a few days by an incident . I am not sure if correct , yet i will say , in the establishing of a peaceful space or balance , sometimes it feels something or somebody will make a bid for us "it" or our peace .
The most beautiful times can be interrupted by intense disturbances , which have contrasted and abruptly shake that peace.
Being caught off gaurd .
A response i notice was one of a closed stance " digging heels in " when confronted with an seeming absurd emotional accostament.
This leads to a situation of tension which makes for " make or break" usually on my emotions and bodily state .
and leaves no room for movement having esablished the seeming stage for which the following act to play out .
Damn triggers too quick .
We can be caught in seeing , obseredly elsewise , or acting off balance . And the balance being struck to ignite action from a more panoramic avanue .
I Defiantly know what your talking about, For me the emotional accosts happen a lot with a specific type of person I usually hang out with, More of the extroverted or those which are emotionally repressed. I usually accept the blows and let them determine the type of justice I will deliver. Most often reacting or acting out in return is usually more detrimental then the initial blow itself. Which I assume is the intent of the blow. For these types Where you don't feel an immediate and Huge damage of energy, Silent justice or triumph is usually the best.
I know exactly what you mean - it happens to me, and I feel it rising up inside me. It is a real skill to pull out into the observation position, and ask, "What on earth are you doing?" Except that seems so limp, when being thrust forward in the heat of the moment into a really outrageous reaction delivers a delicious sense of satisfaction, usually regretted for a long time afterwards.
It does in fact, and I have sometimes attributed this to acts of flyers, although I know this to be a delicate subject for some, I have a little interest in them. But I once saw them working together to steal awareness. And doing a crazy dance is usually the best option, but not always advisable. So it is usually best to subliminate it, and channel it into something else, I find. Yes dealing with the regret is hard sometimes, but its important though to maintain the equilibrium or balance of actions.
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Sir - I don't think I qualify Skyfower :-[ blush
Yes the first attention and the intent that comes with it was the most significant effect, which was also the biggest affect.
Thx for the positive feedback
Of course you qualify! You are welcome.