Topic: Pain and hunger

[Endless Whisper]

"A warrior knows that he is waiting and what he is waiting for; and while he waits he wants nothing, and thus whatever little thing he gets is more than he can take.

If he needs to eat, he finds a way because he is not hungry. If something hurts his body, he finds a way to stop it because he is not in pain. To be hungry or to be in pain means that the man is not a warrior; and the forces of his hunger and pain will destroy him. " ~ASR

I dont get why he said this. "To be in hunger or to be in pain means that the man is not a warrior." Why would this be so? Also, he tries to find a way to stop it (hurt in his body), because he is not in pain.

While I know some writings can come across as 'zen,' these dont come across as zen to me. More like, intentional confusion.

Does anyone read anything different into this? I really dont understand why he said this. Its perplexing.

[Definitive Journey]

Attachment.

Think about it 

I'm off to go get beat up...

Toodles~~~

z

[Endless Whisper]

Attachment.

Think about it 

I'm off to go get beat up...

Toodles~~~

z

Attachment - hmmm, maybe so, maybe so

Have fun getting beat up! LOL

[mayflow]

Attached to the idea of "this is what a warrior is" is attached to the idea of "this is what a warrior is!"

When feeling pain, why not realize "This body is feeling pain?" When hungry, why not realize "This body feels hungry?"

[Endless Whisper]

Attached to the idea of "this is what a warrior is" is attached to the idea of "this is what a warrior is!"

When feeling pain, why not realize "This body is feeling pain?" When hungry, why not realize "This body feels hungry?"

Yeah, it doesnt come across as zen and not totally detachment. The reason is, cause says the warrior still goes and looks for food if there's hunger, but not because he's hungry?

I think its totally extreme. I do accept Kris's answer on detachment, that this may have been the intent, but, if a warrior isnt in pain, in the first place, why bother looking for a remedy for pain? And if isnt hungry, why go look for food?

I did wonder tho if some of the expression wasnt really about bodily pain, or physical hunger, but more like pain and hunger for the soul, 'wanting' something, you know?

[≈*≈]

Maybe the warrior acting impeccably realizes the hunger and immediately remedies it.  He is no longer "hungry".  Or if he is pained, again being impeccable, remedies this immediately, so he is no longer "in pain".  No drama, no attachment.

[littlefeather]

I am assuming that this is don Juan takling to Carlos.  I always try to remember that don Juan sometimes used extroadinary means when teaching Carlos.  Some things he said may have been with the sole intent of driving a point home to Carlos.  So often it wouldn't make much sense to us, in any context.  Carlos was silly and stubborn.

[Endless Whisper]

Maybe the warrior acting impeccably realizes the hunger and immediately remedies it.  He is no longer "hungry".  Or if he is pained, again being impeccable, remedies this immediately, so he is no longer "in pain".  No drama, no attachment.

That is a possibility, however, it still notes he remedies these things 'because he is not hungry/in pain.' Id almost agree, and you're probably right? Because hell, I still cant totally grasp it. I think maybe, its about not 'needing, in the same way of, craving, like the buddhists identify with.

[daphne]

To me it sounds like not identifying with 'the forces' of hunger and/or pain; he simply acts on it; on hunger or on pain and doesn't wait for hunger or pain to act on him.

An example for me is if I have a bad headache, I take a pill. Then I look at what the 'cause' of the headache may be. I eat before I am hungry, and I eat enough without getting too full (except for chocolate that is!!      )

A warrior knows that he is waiting and what he is waiting for; and while he waits he wants nothing, and thus whatever little thing he gets is more than he can take.

One can be "waiting" for anything.. everything.. nothing..

[littlefeather]

I am assuming that this is don Juan takling to Carlos. 

I wrote takling..
interesting.

[Michael]

i would not use the word attachment, or ego for that matter, because those words are too large to enhance understanding.

juan's words make perfect sense to me, and i know people who are being destroyed by their hunger and pain.

those who stand outside their situation find solutions.
those who are consumed by their situation get eaten.

[Sky]

those who stand outside their situation find solutions.
those who are consumed by their situation get eaten.

Yes 

[Endless Whisper]

Yes 

Actually, no.

There is no such thing as 'solutions.'

[Definitive Journey]

i would not use the word attachment, or ego for that matter, because those words are too large to enhance understanding.

This comment above I believe I understand.  What you say here is a feeling that comes across me many times in attempting to find the words to post here, or to describe.  When you have a bit of time, can you expand on this further?

juan's words make perfect sense to me, and i know people who are being destroyed by their hunger and pain.

those who stand outside their situation find solutions.
those who are consumed by their situation get eaten.

Understood.

z

[Definitive Journey]

Actually, no.

There is no such thing as 'solutions.'

Chuckles.......El, do you find it your duty to poke everyone in the eye first, then strike up a convo?   

z