Topic: Ignorance

[runningstream]

How can Ignorance be over come ?

is it possible to reach such a state of detachment to permanently

negate its influence from others and ourselves ?

do such people exist ?

or have they just separated themselves sufficiently to be able to switch off ?

if an annoying person were to poke buddha repeatedly and niggle at him ,

would he withstand that pressure ?

[runningstream]

i will try and articulate it a little more clearly

if a return to emptiness is necessary

has one still got a foot in the world?

what would one then travel upon ?

having renounced ordinary mundane existence

where does one then go





next

in the mean time

during normal workings of life

if one is continually met with ignorance

which beckons ones engagement

and attempts to address it are met with

a game like mentality of continuing on those lines

and keeping the games going

how does the re emerging or healing petty tyrant within ourselves further

continue existence s course?


is it a game of patience to arrive upon more favorable circumstances


is it ignorance alone to re enter upon ignorance in the same way again

[runningstream]

on another angle

would buddha still get pissed off

if he were to re engage with an annoying family member

or a past lover ?


what would he do with that side of affairs

if they were to exist


so then if we are to become an absolute renunciate

or a half variation


with lives which contain jobs and

worldly ties


how is it possible to be completely detached

[Michael]

An old question, but today the answer is simple: we have to do both, at the same time as well as in sequence.

This is not the old days, when people retire to caves and monasteries, although you can still do that. The acolyte of today must excel in both worlds, simultaneously. Think this is onerous? Too right! This is much harder than the aspirants of old.

First, you have to ensure your actions in either world do not undermine the effectiveness of the other. That is extremely difficult.

Secondly, you have to learn the 'rules' of engagement in both worlds. You may be focused on your personal spiritual aspirations, and acquiring those rules is hard enough, but you also need to learn the worldly spirituality of the subway crowd - that is also difficult to grasp.

Lastly, you have to know in which world you are currently acting, and thus, which rules apply.

No one said this path is easy.

[runningstream]

i think if we could give them a moments pause

in detachment

we might stand a better chance

maybe it would be better to concentrate on that


moment of empty cup



as trying to turn water into wine

that way


the water can stay the same


because no new buckets enter the stream


i understand it is easy to crack a bucket


but that wont do it either


how to crack a bucket or pour water in the top


so it cracks itself to see through the hole

[runningstream]

it is frustrating watching people go around in circles

i can do it too


yet i seem to spiral out of it


how can a spiral be given


maybe cards could be made for christmas


and the receiver receives a spiral for christmas


at the beginning of spiral stands themself


somewhere in time


at the other end stands their self walking onwards


periodically within the stream


appearances come and dissappear


the learning or walking would be both their future time speakihg to them

and their past self walking and learning with and as them


as they had opened the gap "space" between such time


everything in between would inform them of their path also


now how to get that into a Christmas card



gravity


that would be a good lesson also


lite and heavy




both float within the stream



awakening to walking


in spiral



would mean


"come to the cafe , we will sit together and order a nice meal "

"i shall show you the pillar the man sat beneath with his baby / child "


the colors represent something one upon the other in spectrum


the roof is on fire



fire reaches ether burning off the old as its up



walking on water that way



take the had and we shall reach the winds which prevail yet leave no thing standing



winds that tear down the house


those winds what will be left standing ?


only that which can withstand the winds by being also and non being



having no clinging

to the ones passing




its a short story



across the road in another cafe


you might see one with a golden hue surrounding them



they might be the new ones walking in


there is something very centered and confident about them whilst the wind

whips every thing and one around them




very calm

[Jahn]

Find a model or an archetype of a person who has passed frustration and ignorance.
Start to imitate their behaviour and listen to their lessons.

[runningstream]

i seemed to have locked the topic again by accident



conincidence




well i saw that photo of the arm wrestling incident


any way Eric these things were'nt created in a vacuum so lets get some bass in here



Jahn


Lets get those guys your speaking about in here right now


because I have had enough of this your religion my religion bullshit

and if we get buddha Jesus mohammad

and chuck norris in here


we can sort this out



i have walked "with" jesus

and i don't mean that in the hansy pansy way either


his blood has coursed through my veins i suppose you could say




if jesus came to earth buddha came to earth and mohammad

with chuck norris



and sat down and you told them to look for a icon to follow what say you !



i'd dare say the pointy end of the spear

is in the hands of the modern seers



as we have their resources available



the devil visited me today



i felt him course through my veins

or my own devil



he through me tells me




standing between the sheets peeping out

and saying new age things like " every body is just a mirror"

and if you don't see it you don't give it power


yet if you can't really stay between the sheets like buddha


how does this help



chuck norris has an answer


im not sure its right


but the buffet after the delightful conversation


will be wonderful



the devil want's to know if i can let chuck norris loose by the way

and give him a blazing sword


Michael i agree with you

although i am trying to meld the two together



as my experience has brought me



I am all ears as to what buddha would bring jesus and chuck norris to the table



the biggest issue i find is assumptions pre ceeding communications



i would love to hear what buddha has to say




i would love to see the stick and ball model of all involved

turned into a fruit platter



i wold dare say the stick ball model would need be inclusive




as those melding the two


and those keeping them separated



might miss each other mid stream not even seeing



and buddha will be between the sheets


and chuck norris will be in a helicopter flying it by instinct alone

[Ke-ke wan]

i will try and articulate it a little more clearly

if a return to emptiness is necessary

has one still got a foot in the world?

what would one then travel upon ?

having renounced ordinary mundane existence

where does one then go

I saw a really good quote recently but I can not find it again.

It said soemthing like your task is to be open enough to feel the cares of the world and cry for it, but not be affected by it.
You must also become detached enough to sit across the table with mosters and killers and not be affected.

Anyone know the quote I mean?  Or did I dream that?  It's hard to tell sometimes.

[runningstream]

i am blazing a tail today

direction has a tail

and i need that tail wind to pull the stars with it

[runningstream]

about the meaning of faith

its no different than claiming your sovereignty

i spoke to a man before

his words said "best of luck with it"

yet he meant by it instead " your kidding yourself no hope"

i felt that

yet i am pulling all the stars with me

and i see him for what he is

so my faith knows he is testing me

it is my faith that will blaze a tail today and pull the stars with it

now i am pointing at the tail

don't look too hard or you might miss it

it will appear in front of you

i think it is necessary to use that faith and personal drive

to hold it dear

[Ke-ke wan]

Faith is a funny word.

Depending on your (personal) definition of it, can mean any number of things.  Me, not religious, never have been so a religious connotation of faith is not even in myscope of perception. have had discussions on faith though with people who are very anti religion and can't seem to see that my faith has nothing to do with any god or religious texts.  For me, it's close to intent.

[runningstream]

Then intent implies movement with direction

Faith as I used the term implies spirit or source coming from all angles towards us

Within time

So therefore "faith" yourself whole or the source you are

Is complete and now your are a force to be reckoned with in your movement

within this living water

[Ke-ke wan]

Then intent implies movement with direction

Faith as I used the term implies spirit or source coming from all angles towards us

Within time

So therefore "faith" yourself whole or the source you are

Is complete and now your are a force to be reckoned with in your movement

within this living water

We are on a similar page

[runningstream]

Then we are strong trees