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Author Topic: *Egypt  (Read 63568 times)

Offline Michael

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #165 on: April 17, 2013, 02:42:11 AM »
I should just add that this 'frame-choice' technique is also one I use regularly. I especially use it when the frame in question has not yet loaded - doesn't matter if it's actually happened in linear time, so long as I don't know. I use this in both large and small matters. I actively select the frame I prefer, in my own consciousness, and then 'hop' across.

Two things restrict this.
The selection has to be known to be available - this requires knowledge of the possibility, past experience for personal confidence that it can in fact be done, and the ability to remember to do it. Those are not easy, but they are in fact the easy part. The second thing is more difficult:

The hop. Actually I see this more as allowing the frame to draw me into it, but 'hop' is a nice image to speak about it. The problem with being able to hop to the selected frame is that we have all these internal restraints working against it. This is why DJ sent CC back to recapitulation again and again, as there are multiple inner forces that sabotage our natural abilities. Such that often children can do this much easier, if they only knew about it. A major part of my whole pragmatic approach is to work at clearing the subconscious forces which sabotage our natural state of freedom, but also to build the strength to withstand the impact of the shell cracking, without which we only talk to ourselves in the mirror - no frame hopping is possible or safe until the shell can open and close at will.

I also see one other thing which restricts this. This is best explained by the more sophisticated concept of karma in Hinduism. I won't go into it too deeply, except to say there are layers of karma. Superficial layers hold frames that we can easily change. Deeper layers hold frames that it is generally considered too entrenched, for us to acquire the power within one life, to change. In our terms here, that means all frames can be changed, but we need the personal power and transparency to match the frame. To select a frame like shifting the AP of the Earth, would require a massive potency of many adepts over a long period of time, as CC implied, or a single being with the personal potency to match the embedded force of that frame.

I am inclined to have some sympathy with CC's interest in this, despite my feeling he was no where up to the task. Furthermore, I also feel the Earth has reached a critical phase, in which we are likely to see many adepts, alive or at least still existing, take a hand in the matter, who previously felt it was none of their business. What is difficult in this, is understanding which frame for the Earth's AP is the one we should pull to. 'Best for the Earth' is not always what we would like to see. The only response I have for this, is to remain as alert as possible to where I see the influence of wiser beings than I. This is not easy, but not that impossible either, so long as one realises that it is 'spirit' we value rather than it's manifestation.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2013, 04:01:14 AM by Michael »

Kal

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #166 on: April 18, 2013, 01:12:42 AM »
Quoting back from April 1:

By all means Nikosv, this is your thread after all.

In my view the eagle reflects back to you what you are, if you die, then you are a being that lived a reflective furrow that ended in death. Then the singularity known by you as Nikosv, would fade and the observer, free of the singular self reflective  identity would enter another furrow in time or not.

This benevolent bit is a reflection is it not? I stated that the furrow reflects to you what you are, and that reflection changes with the attention level attained and maintained. I suppose the common view is that there is something out there effecting our senses, but what is interacting with us boils down eventually to a view. Something is either outside of us or not, which in my view can be resolved by the view one takes.


I would like to emphasise on discussion about the last sentences of the paragraph... :

I suppose the common view is that there is something out there effecting our senses, but what is interacting with us boils down eventually to a view. Something is either outside of us or not, which in my view can be resolved by the view one takes.


I disagree with it and probably will add why shortly.

-/-/_

The reason is, a case of battle and that I see it somehow (still, for what we are discussing for some time) unresolved.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2013, 01:21:58 AM by Nikosv »

Kal

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #167 on: April 18, 2013, 01:27:30 AM »

My belief stand/is that this thing (The Eagle) has no attention, but that doesn't/can't make sense

so, I would then say,

that it doesn't uses attention.

-------

"attention!"

Kal

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Offline runningstream

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #169 on: April 18, 2013, 09:52:09 AM »
Good , reason craps out , ""attention"" . non attention , as a flicker takes form it has already passed by , so by "" displacement "" appearance , this displacement occuring reveal significant insubstantiality , as displacement being , awareness is non stationary , " will " ocuring " reason " , " fin-ite" , insubstantial , " displacement " , power , occurence , fine - nite , liquid image flow forth , simultaneous existing motion. , eg . Motion / displacement ,
"honing in" , movement , unifying , "" attention "" insightful / non attention , the unlearning of known through displacement .
I am in agreement on , spirits hand in affairs of being " impersonal " to degree of removing " personal " , inquisitive action . passing through / displacing attention as act of unifying motion / usefully applied within motion .

Kal

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #170 on: April 18, 2013, 11:40:15 AM »

Runningstream, I 'm afraid that's the path of the double,

which is not a path, in 'absolute' terms.

Kal

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #171 on: April 18, 2013, 11:58:10 AM »

Though, that's just my perspective on it, and the path I follow.

I concentrate on balance however it's possible.

much can be said, but I believe its true that everyone has his own path and he and she is unique.

Quote
"that everyone has his own path and he and she is unique."...

I value very much this fact,statement.

             ~

We are like little flames in a world of a billion stars. I can't see myself as anything else ,

at least currently.

Nick

Kal

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runningstream-
« Reply #172 on: April 18, 2013, 02:09:31 PM »
just a little note, that I use the word double on my own terms,

not as Michael uses it.

NV-

Offline runningstream

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #173 on: April 19, 2013, 11:57:04 AM »
What does that mean nikos ? Not a path in absolute terms? The path of the double , what does that connection mean to you?

Kal

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #174 on: April 19, 2013, 12:23:58 PM »

Nothing running..

forget it.  ;D

I started this thread as a gesture about love in a way and the double discussion popped in.  ;D

I don't know what I mean,... I saw it all in the blackfield.


Offline Michael

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #175 on: April 21, 2013, 06:00:58 AM »
"You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: those with loaded guns and those who dig."
A message from my double, seeing as you asked.

Offline runningstream

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #176 on: April 24, 2013, 07:11:42 AM »
Then a
Message
To you both
, to seed and yield ,
one foot
Must be placed at furrow
and another the hand must throw
To forego either side or lean too far
Another thing will sway

Offline Endless~Knot

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #177 on: July 12, 2013, 06:41:40 PM »


Excellent post Nik!
You know, in all the time Restless Soma has been running, I have never seen such a post which enables me to explain something so fundamental to this forum.

We have 48 current members and probably double that in others who have deleted their membership. And how many do you see posting here? None (except for you and on occasion Nemo, who will most likely seek more exciting venues). Do you know why they don't post anymore? Precisely for the reason you have so artlessly articulated. I will explain. Your English may not be up to all the concepts I outline, but I recommend you ponder this post carefully.

We all have many me's. There is the me our family know, the me our friends know, the me our work scene knows, the me the government knows (usually by a number). The me our intimate partner knows / has known / will know. And so forth: the angry me, the quiet me, the frightened me, the confident me, the child me, the parent me, the adult me....

Then there is the private me - the secret me who no one else really knows, because no one takes the time and trouble to find out. For many people the private me is weak and vague, but for some of us, it is the most important me in our bag-of-me's: it is the real me. Most people who find their way to this forum have a strong sense of this private me. They come here seeking validation and recognition for their private me. Unfortunately, they don't find that here. Do you know why?

This forum was set up for a different purpose. You see, there is another me which has been forgotten. This me can never be known fully, because it's very nature is mystery. It does not belong to the common battleground of me's within us - amongst the perennial struggle for each me to survive or dominate, this mystery me is always absent. It exists outside the sense of completeness we all have about our being. It is the unknown me. We call this me the double.

Restless Soma is set up and dedicated to the path of the double.

I have always been aware of this as I have seen many who had weak links to their double and they eventually folded. Some had to be banned because they behaved like children.

Quote

You are absolutely candid and correct in saying "I just feel a restriction in expressing me." No one has ever put it better.

In this forum, we do not set out to obstruct the private me. There is every good reason for the healthy growth of the private me. But the forum is what it is, and that means every member eventually finds themselves before a struggle between the private me and the double. Some succeeded in this struggle, whereby their private me came to the realisation that they were not the only ruler of their destiny, and thus arrived at a constructive sharing of power with this elusive being, the double. They were the small minority, and they moved on to their next phase of growth in which a close partnership with the double became the core of their path.


Very few.


The greater majority left Restless Soma because they failed the challenge. They chose to reject their double and retain the sovereignty of their private me. These people believe the growth in power of their private me is what spirituality is all about. They found Restless Soma a hindrance to their 'spiritual' path - the path of their private me. They had no choice but to leave.
[/quote]

I disagree with some of this. This is the reason why and I feel qualified because I communicated with many of them. I believe what people were doing is looking for a)conversation where they would be praised for their efforts, b) validation they were on the right track and c) also entertainment. When they did not get 'fed' these things, eventually they got frustrated and left.

Quote

Of course they will all deny this vehemently, but because you have articulated this dilemma so simply and clearly, for the very first time in Restless Soma, I am telling you now what is really happening here in this forum. That is the reason it is called Restless.

This restless soma.. yada yada. I know. This place is not for the faint at heart. That is why I like it.

Quote

The only people who find their way here are those who have approached a critical threshold in their life journey. They are ready for the challenge of the double. There can be no peace in our soul until this challenge has been successfully negotiated, thus it is known as the restless phase of the path - there can be no peace in a soul that is estranged from the double, once the possibility of it's existence is intuited.

Your private me is correct in it's desire to not return here, but it is your double that has brought you back, no matter what reason you think you returned for. That is why I said I "thought you might have been trying to fight your double on this".

The path of the double can only be entered upon once the double has evolved sufficiently to actively intervene in our life. Unfortunately, for most people, the double lacks the power or the wisdom to intervene effectively, and thus to challenge the authority of the private me. (By contract, there are many stories of doubles striking down all the me's inside and taking undisputed control, but rarely do you meet such cases in real life, and anyway, such domination by the double is not advised - a partnership is the best.)

Your comment above indicates your private me has the intelligence to see clearly, the honesty to acknowledge the situation, and the lack of overbearing self-importance to speak it out loud on the forum. These are excellent signs.

Now you must make a choice. Will your private me allow for the possibility of the existence of a rival - another me of equal or greater authority, which you know nothing about? Are you willing to set to one side your private me for the path of the double? Only you can make that choice, and only I will know what choice you have made.

Ok. I have some comments on all this just some of my opinions.

Like I eluded above, people want praise. This comes from the 'private me' as you put it, who is reared by parents who give positive reinforcement when you do good, and discipline when you do 'bad.' Because of this mentality, this did not go over well, cause when people were reacting the way they did in here, they did not get reinforcement. And RS is not a place which gives positive reinforcement. The reason is because yes, this is a place to connect with the double and try to integrate the double into life. However, most are shielded for some time, and only those who truly work at spiritual growth are going to incorporate their double, in any positive way.

There is a spiritual forum around which has about 500 members or so, with various topics, and there is very little criticism, and must pat on the backing in the place. This can be fine for a sense of community if someone is seeking that. However one is not going to grow in such an environment. One has to be ruthless with the private me.

I do not know if the answer is to eradicate the private me, or just turn it into a little silent voice and make it small. I don't know for certain. The sufis say to destroy it, so do the buddhas, but psychologists dont think this is healthy. However, whatever we do we can transform the private me, by integrating the double. Then instead of the double being the tool to use to 'bring out the box' when the 'call is on,' the double is strong and alive, and the private me can be brought out, when it is necessary. I do not know if you agree or disagree with the private me aspect, if it should be slayed or just tempered. I have yet to uncover what is the necessary approach to it for spiritual growth.

I think people feel safer reading the forum, versus communicating, because they do not see the same sense of community. To myself, RS is a place where I can come, I sit in front of the laptop, and not just 'think' about what to say, but really, dig into the core, and 'feel' what perhaps spirit, or double, wants me to say and say it. But it is not just that. I want to see if from what I write - my creation - I can see the double's magic. For example, today I wrote my posts to you. I had the feeling there was something in my astro report. Sure enough, something on criticism was in my report.

How I saw this, was a 'jolt' from spirit, and from my double aka a message. And this is pretty much how I operate. When I get the jolt, this causes my mind to seek out the double, and look for the higher purpose of it all.

Another odd happening was I was reading what the guests were reading, and one of the posts I wrote on personal power came up. So I read it, over and over. My God I wrote that post five years ago! And it still has a ring of truth to it. I read it to my daughter and she said it was good. I told her, "You didn't know I could write like that, did you?" But I can when I connect with Spirit, my Double. I can feel that flow and the message comes forth.

I think another thing why some have teetered off, is not they weren't trying, but they got 'stuck' and could not get 'unstuck.' I know you said we dont really shift the ap, and I agree, but we do change our perception (like Jahn says). They were not able to change their perception, so they could not change their circumstances, and got stuck. To myself, this really requires getting a new set of eyes on the path, so you can see things differently.

This is not an easy forum where you can write easy peasy stuff. You really have to dig deep to get something meaningful out. And I realise that is why you said I was being boring. I need to really dig deep, because the more I dig, I will get closer and closer to the double. So I will do my best to dig a little deeper when I write. And then use the rest of the time for some silence.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2013, 06:46:20 PM by Endless~Knot »
“Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, and add what is uniquely your own.” - Bruce Lee

Offline Endless~Knot

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #178 on: July 12, 2013, 06:43:08 PM »
"You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: those with loaded guns and those who dig."
A message from my double, seeing as you asked.

So odd. I just saw this after I wrote this post. I wrote about digging deeper, than saw this.

Well I guess that's Restless Soma for you...
“Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, and add what is uniquely your own.” - Bruce Lee

Offline Endless~Knot

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Re: *Egypt
« Reply #179 on: July 12, 2013, 06:43:47 PM »
Michael...

I'm back...
“Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, and add what is uniquely your own.” - Bruce Lee